Is Luzardo a realistic target?

[oriolediehard]

52 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

No. I’d rather just roll with what we’ve got if that’s what  it takes.

 

It looks like Kimbrel is our big and only move of the off-season! I don't hear bleep about any moves being talked about. I hope we win with what we got. I hope there are surprise pitching prospects we have pan out.

[HakunaSakata]

40 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

Do Cowser, Holiday, and Kjerstad have the same value? Of course not …. Say they value Norby for his offensive production then maybe you give them a 4th player or a better 4th player. 
 

Honestly, I’d offer Cowser and Santander. By the trade sim (which I’m not a fan of) they would win the trade by 2 plus points. 

I think you might want to clean your glasses then look at that trade sim again. 

https://imgur.com/a/0kB9smm

[RZNJ]

8 minutes ago, oriolediehard said:

It looks like Kimbrel is our big and only move of the off-season! I don't hear bleep about any moves being talked about. I hope we win with what we got. I hope there are surprise pitching prospects we have pan out.

We don’t hear about Oriole moves until they happen.

[Safelykept]

1 hour ago, RZNJ said:

Most were ready to do Cowser and Ortiz for Cease.   Luzardo is, arguably, coming off a better year and has an extra year of service time.  It’s hard to believe they want a ML balanced package since they are trading Luzardo.  They might want a combination.   I’d guess something like this.

Ortiz (Westburg is not a true SS and Arráez is stuck at 2B if Josh Bell is the 1B), Cowser, Santander, Urías.   They can plug Santander into RF, move Jesus Sanchez and bench Bryan De La Cruz.  Urias can share 3B with the defensively challenged Jake Burger, allowing Burger to get DH AB’s.   Cowser can get RF starts and replace Santander defensively late.  Ortiz becomes their starting SS.  It’s a lot to give up and there is pressure on Kjerstad to replace Santander.   There is still the potential for Mayo to move to RF and the possibility that Westburg or Norby can play left freeing Hays up for RF.   Those are options as trading both Cowser and Santander decreases OF depth. 
 

Too much?  Maybe but it’s also maybe a deal.

Too much?, maybe not and not as off the wall as some of the other trades being floated around. I would do that deal, but for Luzardo I think the Marlins are looking for one of Mayo, Bassillo to headline  and for my money we should think about it at some point you have to give something to get something

[Sports Guy]

1 minute ago, Safelykept said:

Too much?, maybe not and not as off the wall as some of the other trades being floated around. I would do that deal, but for Luzardo I think the Marlins are looking for one of Mayo, Bassillo to headline  and for my money we should think about it at some point you have to give something to get something

They may be looking for one of them but I doubt they get that level of prospect. Now, maybe they keep him if they don’t and that’s fine but I just don’t see it happening.

[HakunaSakata]

1 hour ago, Frobby said:

Hmmm, exaggerate much?  I was impressed by Vinnie when we played KC, and yes he has a lot more service time.  He’s significantly more valuable than Santander.   Still, he’s coming off shoulder surgery (non-throwing shoulder) and a 108 OPS+ partial season.  So I’m guessing it’s 999 tor less times more valuable.  

Touche! I concede 1%.  And the shoulder looks pretty good to me...

 

 

[Just Regular]

The Marlins now with Jorge Soler are where we may be in mid-December with Santander a year from now - a bunch of HR/RBI are gone but the GM still might be trying to retain at a good price.

We'll get some information how Santander fits when Soler-Teoscar-Hoskins sign, but I will say Hunter Renfroe only 2/13 was pretty cheap.

Hays has the same 2-1 edge on Santander that Cease does on Burnes for rentals.

I'm fuzzy on whether Miami and new GM Peter Bendix are keeping wildcard competing posture or maybe pulling back in a year of Sandy Alcantara's absence and Eury Perez ramping up towards world domination.     They might not have any taste for the Austin Hays-Cole Irvin kind of guy.      I could see Elias hoping something like Ortiz, Hays, Irvin might do it, presuming the Marlins still care enough about 2024.

[HakunaSakata]

2 minutes ago, Just Regular said:

The Marlins now with Jorge Soler are where we may be in mid-December with Santander a year from now - a bunch of HR/RBI are gone but the GM still might be trying to retain at a good price.

Are they (HRs gone) really though? They added Burger and Bell at the trade deadline which should account for Soler's HRs and then some. I really don't see the Marlins as having a huge HR hole to fill. Also, HRs are probably one of the easiest things to get in the FA market. Santander leaving doesn't worry me at all because his skill set is one of the easiest to replace. 

[Safelykept]

8 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

They may be looking for one of them but I doubt they get that level of prospect. Now, maybe they keep him if they don’t and that’s fine but I just don’t see it happening.

Maybe not, but the point being at some point if we want get better we have to take on some risk, we have more prospect capitol than anybody.

[waroriole]

23 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

We don’t hear about Oriole moves until they happen.

There was talk of the Orioles being heavily involved in the bullpen market a good week before Kimbrel signed. 

[sportsfan8703]

Santander, Ortiz, O’Hearn, and Urias gets it done. Fills all the Marlins holes except C. Hurts enough to mean that it is enough to get a deal done.

I’d be thrilled for Elias to get it done for less. However, does Elias do it?  Remember the part about not having too many rookies cutting their teeth at the same time?  With this, we’d have Cowser, Kjerstad, and one of Holliday/Mayo all on the OD roster. We’d definitely try to bring back Hicks if this went down. Maybe even a Whit Merrifield type too for depth. Or Frazier reunion. 

Replacements -

Santa - Cowser or Hicks

O’Hearn - Kjerstad or Hicks

Urias - Holliday/Mayo

Edited December 16, 2023 by sportsfan8703

[RZNJ]

29 minutes ago, waroriole said:

There was talk of the Orioles being heavily involved in the bullpen market a good week before Kimbrel signed. 

Big deal.  They’ve been “interested” in just about everyone.

[sportsfan8703]

2 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Big deal.  They’ve been “interested” in just about everyone.

Yeah, that’s been our MO, but this offseason is breaking our direction with the Dodgers and Mets overtaking NYY and BOS as the annual offseason giants. There’s Burnes, Luzardo, and Cease, up for trades, and the big boys are likely out. 

The best we can root for is the Dodgers and Mets to clean up 2-3 more FA SP. 

[RZNJ]

30 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Santander, Ortiz, O’Hearn, and Urias gets it done. Fills all the Marlins holes except C. Hurts enough to mean that it is enough to get a deal done.

I’d be thrilled for Elias to get it done for less. However, does Elias do it?  Remember the part about not having too many rookies cutting their teeth at the same time?  With this, we’d have Cowser, Kjerstad, and one of Holliday/Mayo all on the OD roster. We’d definitely try to bring back Hicks if this went down. Maybe even a Whit Merrifield type too for depth. Or Frazier reunion. 

Replacements -

Santa - Cowser or Hicks

O’Hearn - Kjerstad or Hicks

Urias - Holliday/Mayo

Two players who are FA after this year plus Urias and one prospect.   I don’t think so.

[waroriole]

8 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Big deal.  They’ve been “interested” in just about everyone.

You said there’s no talk before the Orioles sign someone. The only person they’ve signed came after a lot of talk for a week that they’re interested in the bullpen market.