Tallion vs. Whitson

[Hutman]

I for one have been big on the Tallion bandwagon for the # 3 pick, but I am really starting to think that Whitson may be the better pick.

Here is what the experts are saying:

PNR Scouting

Jameson Taillon, Senior, The Woodlands HS (Texas) (1)

Karsten Whitson, Senior, Chipley HS (Fla.) (4)

Stotle has Tallion as the best RHSP and the best fastball

Keith Law ESPN Insider:

Tallion: Analysis: Unusual arm strength, up to 98 mph as a starter, but hitters see his fastball. Feb. 19: No. 3

Whitson: Analysis: The best command of the premium prep arms in the class, with a chance for four pitches. Feb. 19: No. 15

Baseball Rumor Mill:

"Taillon may throw harder than Karsten Whitson, but one scout felt Whitson's fastball was the best because of its movement. Whitson was still throwing 94, not shabby at all. His slider was also impressive, but Whitson did not demonstrate good command of the pitch."

So if the draft goes Harper to the Nats, Machado to the Bucs, who do we take at # 3?

[napbow]

I read Law's write-up the other night and was thinking the same thing. I would like to hear the opinion of some of the more knowledgeable posters.

After watching Matusz pitch, I am really starting to lean towards prospects with strong command of the strike zone vs. power.

[Avsfan]

A slower fastball with movement >>>> a faster straight fastball.

we're talking 3-8mph...not like 10-15.

[Greg Pappas]

The answer of who we take if Player A and B are gone can no longer be assumed- after last year's 1st-round selection. Under your scenario, Taillon -at this juncture- seems to be the most likely candidate as the 'best player available'... though again, Jordan may follow up last year's Hobgood pick with another 'surprise'. Time will tell.

[allstar1579]

I read Law's write-up the other night and was thinking the same thing. I would like to hear the opinion of some of the more knowledgeable posters.

After watching Matusz pitch, I am really starting to lean towards prospects with strong command of the strike zone vs. power.

The old power vs. finesse debate. Both have pluses and minuses, I'm more of a case by case kinda guy, some others lean more towards one or the other.

[Hutman]

The old power vs. finesse debate. Both have pluses and minuses, I'm more of a case by case kinda guy, some others lean more towards one or the other.

Whitson pitches low ninties and tops off at 94, not sure if that makes him a finess pitcher or not, Tallion is mid ninties and tops off at 98. Whitson sounds a lot like Matusz (whose fastball also tops off in that range as well)in that he has 4 good pitches but not on outstanding pitch.

[rhall]

Whitson pitches low ninties and tops off at 94, not sure if that makes him a finess pitcher or not, Tallion is mid ninties and tops off at 98. Whitson sounds a lot like Matusz (whose fastball also tops off in that range as well)in that he has 4 good pitches but not on outstanding pitch.

I don't think that's accurate. Sure, his fastball plays up because of his off-speed stuff, but his changeup looks pretty outstanding to me. On some nights, so does his curveball. And Whitson's repertoire is still primarily fastball/slider. His changeup shows promise, but you can say that of a lot of young pitchers. It is good that he's working on it while still in highschool, though.

Law's comment is actually the first time I've heard 4 pitches mentioned with Whitson. Anyone know what it is?

[allstar1579]

Whitson pitches low ninties and tops off at 94, not sure if that makes him a finess pitcher or not, Tallion is mid ninties and tops off at 98. Whitson sounds a lot like Matusz (whose fastball also tops off in that range as well)in that he has 4 good pitches but not on outstanding pitch.

It does. When you say "finesse" pitcher, it's just a guy that has really good secondaries and "pitches" more than "throws". A power pitcher usually relies on the hard stuff and blows it past competition until they get to a level where that doesn't work anymore, they find themselves in the position of learning how to pitch on the spot with much harder competition. (Cabrera, Liz, etc.) I would consider Matusz a "finesse" guy, but don't take that word as a stigma, most people hear it and assume 40 year old lefty throwing 83 mph. It's not to say that they can't rear back and throw the ball hard, they just usually sit low 90's and have 3-4 polished pitches.

[rhall]

It does. When you say "finesse" pitcher, it's just a guy that has really good secondaries and "pitches" more than "throws". A power pitcher usually relies on the hard stuff and blows it past competition until they get to a level where that doesn't work anymore, they find themselves in the position of learning how to pitch on the spot with much harder competition. (Cabrera, Liz, etc.) I would consider Matusz a "finesse" guy, but don't take that word as a stigma, most people hear it and assume 40 year old lefty throwing 83 mph. It's not to say that they can't rear back and throw the ball hard, they just usually sit low 90's and have 3-4 polished pitches.

I think this shows how difficult it can be to try to fit everyone into only 2 categories - finesse and power - especially when there are probably different opinions of what they mean/entail. I think it's important to point out that these two categories should represent their pitching style more than the quality of their stuff. That's how I look at it. A power pitcher likes to challenge hitters. A finesse guy will try to outsmart the hitter and keep him off balance. That may be an oversimplification. Most guys are probably a mixture of the two.

You can have a guy with pure power stuff that still pitches like a finesse pitcher. That's a lethal mix - Pedro Martinez or Zack Greinke. Or you can have a guy without overpowering stuff (at least in velo) that still relishes challenging hitters. The first guy that comes to my mind there is Wandy Rodriguez.

[Stotle]

I don't think that's accurate. Sure, his fastball plays up because of his off-speed stuff, but his changeup looks pretty outstanding to me. On some nights, so does his curveball. And Whitson's repertoire is still primarily fastball/slider. His changeup shows promise, but you can say that of a lot of young pitchers. It is good that he's working on it while still in highschool, though.

Law's comment is actually the first time I've heard 4 pitches mentioned with Whitson. Anyone know what it is?

I've seen Whitson a couple of times and have only seen FB/SL/CH.

[waroriole]

I have very limited knowledge of the guys we could take, basically it all comes from this place, but I'd like to see us take a guy like Whitson. He seems more like a pitcher, and less of a project. That said, I'm comfortable in Jordan to take the guy who he thinks fits best.

[Stotle]

Law and Goldstein seems confident BAL is targeting Taillon, and that PIT is in no way interested in Taillon, so that is good news for everyone here.

[clapdiddy]

Law and Goldstein seems confident BAL is targeting Taillon, and that PIT is in no way interested in Taillon, so that is good news for everyone here.

Even though we might be targeting position players, you still need to take the BPA. If Taillon is that guy, you have to take him.

[mex-bird]

Law and Goldstein seems confident BAL is targeting Taillon, and that PIT is in no way interested in Taillon, so that is good news for everyone here.

Hopefully

[Stotle]

Who'd they have us taking last year? I'm guessing neither one had us taking Hobgood even a week before the draft. I'm sure this is their best guess but I take it with a grain of salt.

I would expect nothing less. The fact that there have been mocks floating around the internet for a couple of months is laughable. Still, I think it's decent news that BAL is even considering Taillon. Could be that they simply haven't talked $$ with him yet, though. He's the best arm in the draft -- I would love if BAL ended-up with him.