Is it ok to give up on Miguel Gonzalez?

[SteveA]

Miggy tonight:. 3.1 innings, 8 hits, 4 walks, 7 runs.

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[brooks1083]

In the easy National League..

That's why I said I'm not even confident in Ubaldo's ability to get a NL pitcher out.

[25 Nuggets]

Don't be fooled. Miggy is pitching a little better than last year, but not so well that people should be pining for him.

3.1 IP, 8 hits, 4 walks, 7 ER tonight.

[Mendoza Line]

3.1 IP, 8 hits, 4 walks, 7 ER tonight.

Yikes! Arguably still better than Ubaldo the other day

[Phantom]

3.1 IP, 8 hits, 4 walks, 7 ER tonight.

And boom goes the dynamite.

[LookitsPuck]

3.1 IP, 8 hits, 4 walks, 7 ER tonight.

SO/9 is up, HR/9 is down. Hit rate and walk rate is up, however. Not dramatically, but still.

That said, he's started 8 games this year. 3 were clunkers, the rest were very good (4 starts of allowing 2 ER or less, 1 start of 3 ER).

I'd take Gonzo every.single.time over Ubaldo and Mike Wright.

[atomic]

SO/9 is up, HR/9 is down. Hit rate and walk rate is up, however. Not dramatically, but still.

That said, he's started 8 games this year. 3 were clunkers, the rest were very good (4 starts of allowing 2 ER or less, 1 start of 3 ER).

I'd take Gonzo every.single.time over Ubaldo and Mike Wright.

A couple more games like that and Gonzalez could be DFAed again. And we could pick him back up.

[Phantom]

SO/9 is up, HR/9 is down. Hit rate and walk rate is up, however. Not dramatically, but still.

That said, he's started 8 games this year. 3 were clunkers, the rest were very good (4 starts of allowing 2 ER or less, 1 start of 3 ER).

I'd take Gonzo every.single.time over Ubaldo and Mike Wright.

His 4.36 Fip, 4.64 xFiP and 4.62 SIERA really blow Ubaldo's 4.45/4.73/4.88 out of the water.

[Redskins Rick]

SO/9 is up, HR/9 is down. Hit rate and walk rate is up, however. Not dramatically, but still.

That said, he's started 8 games this year. 3 were clunkers, the rest were very good (4 starts of allowing 2 ER or less, 1 start of 3 ER).

I'd take Gonzo every.single.time over Ubaldo and Mike Wright.

He has started 7, the one game, 1.1 innings middle relief.

So basically, its 50-50, good game vs clunker.

Ubaldo is in the pen.

[LookitsPuck]

He has started 7, the one game, 1.1 innings middle relief.

So basically, its 50-50, good game vs clunker.

Ubaldo is in the pen.

He started 8. I already deducted one from his total, see game logs for 2016:

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/gl.cgi?id=gonzami03&t=p&year=2016

[Redskins Rick]

He started 8. I already deducted one from his total, see game logs for 2016:

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/gl.cgi?id=gonzami03&t=p&year=2016

My bad, need to get my bifocals fixed.

UGHHH.

[LookitsPuck]

His 4.36 Fip, 4.64 xFiP and 4.62 SIERA really blow Ubaldo's 4.45/4.73/4.88 out of the water.

Ubaldo vs. Gonzo:

ERA+: 63 vs. 85

ERA: 6.89 vs. 4.74

WHIP: 1.979 vs. 1.534

SO/9: 7.6 vs. 7.6

BB/9: 5.0 vs. 3.9

H/9: 12.8 vs. 9.9

At some point FIP becomes a useless stat. Need to look big picture and all the starts. And big picture Ubaldo's numbers are very 2015 Bud Norris-eque.

I'm still sold on Gonzo being a solid #4/#5 for the ChiSox all season. His velocity is right in line with career norms. Not saying he's the Gonzo of old control wise, but still can be effective.

[Phantom]

Ubaldo vs. Gonzo:

ERA+: 63 vs. 85

ERA: 6.89 vs. 4.74

WHIP: 1.979 vs. 1.534

SO/9: 7.6 vs. 7.6

BB/9: 5.0 vs. 3.9

H/9: 12.8 vs. 9.9

At some point FIP becomes a useless stat.

It is better at predicting future performance than any stat you posted. And isn't that the goal? We know Gonzo has been better than Ubaldo. At this point, we are trying to figure out who would be better going forward, so FiP is very useful (SIERA even moreso).

Need to look big picture and all the starts. And big picture Ubaldo's numbers are very 2015 Bud Norris-eque.

Bud had a 5.69 FiP with us in 2015.

[LookitsPuck]

It is better at predicting future performance than any stat you posted. And isn't that the goal? We know Gonzo has been better than Ubaldo. At this point, we are trying to figure out who would be better going forward, so FiP is very useful (SIERA even moreso).

Bud had a 5.69 FiP with us in 2015.

FIP has never been friendly w/ Gonzo. His career line is 4.67. His 4.36 that you used is actually the lowest of his MLB career.

It generally doesn't like Gonzo because of his strikeout rate and hit rate. He also allows his fair share of homers.

I don't think it's generally an end all be all of numbers to use because it doesn't tell the entire story. It weighs heavily on homers (multiplier is 13) that has a tendency to wash out pitchers that might otherwise be good if not for the gopher ball. Chris Tillman is a perfect example.

Guess what Tilly's career FIP is? It shouldn't surprise you that it's close to Gonzo (4.45). And why is that? High HR rate.

The problem w/ FIP is it also favours Ubaldo way too heavily. It actually puts a lot of love to ground ball pitchers, who traditionally don't allow many homers. It loves TJ McFarland, who in my opinion isn't very good.

[25 Nuggets]

I'm still sold on Gonzo being a solid #4/#5 for the ChiSox all season. His velocity is right in line with career norms. Not saying he's the Gonzo of old control wise, but still can be effective.

I understand he's been better than Jimenez, but I am not sold on him being a solid anything. Can't we pine for a better pitcher these days?