O's management and former O's pitchers

[Redskins Rick]

It was the money. If they couldn't have saved any cash by releasing him they wouldn't have cut him in spring training.

So the fact, that he sucked the whole 2nd half and then comes into ST, rested, and still having issues with velocity and not pitching well, had nothing to do with it?

I think DD was allowed to increase the payroll, IMO and they are all-in for trying to win the WS, that small amount of money (in relationship to the payroll) didn't move the needle, and if they thought they could have sent him to AAA and rehabbed him, they would have done it.

Maybe they had a private talk with Gonzo and said, release or send to the minors and try to rework yourself, and he took the route?

[Aristotelian]

Bud just got removed from his last start with a back injury--probably aggravated the same problem he had prior to spring training 2014. Probably not the best example.

Miguel is doing fine but isn't winning any Cy Young awards like Jake. It would have been great to keep Miguel, but I am glad we got to try out Wilson, Wright, and Worley for a while. Now we have Miley, who should put up comparable numbers to Miguel at pretty similar dollars. Bottom line, Miguel is a replaceable guy.

Jake is still the only really bad example and you can't say one pitcher says anything about the organization.

[Can_of_corn]

They'd never have been able to sign Gallardo without the savings from Gonzalez.

They signed Gallardo on Feb 25th. Gonzalez was released on March 30th.

[Can_of_corn]

So the fact, that he sucked the whole 2nd half and then comes into ST, rested, and still having issues with velocity and not pitching well, had nothing to do with it?

I think DD was allowed to increase the payroll, IMO and they are all-in for trying to win the WS, that small amount of money (in relationship to the payroll) didn't move the needle, and if they thought they could have sent him to AAA and rehabbed him, they would have done it.

Maybe they had a private talk with Gonzo and said, release or send to the minors and try to rework yourself, and he took the route?

They would have sent him down.

Why wouldn't they send him down if the money was the same?

Too many pitching prospects at Norfolk?

No room on the 40?

[Redskins Rick]

They would have sent him down.

Why wouldn't they send him down if the money was the same?

Too many pitching prospects at Norfolk?

No room on the 40?

Okay, I buy the no room on the 40.

[Can_of_corn]

Okay, I buy the no room on the 40.

Henry was on the 40.

[DrungoHazewood]

They signed Gallardo on Feb 25th. Gonzalez was released on March 30th.

Whatever, man. If you want to buy into DD's "timeline" go ahead and drink the Orange kool aid the establishment's feeding you.

[sportsfan8703]

Jason Hammel is one to add to the list

I always liked him but we made no effort to re-sign him

and he has been very effective

Jason Hammel? Are you serious? Did you watch the 2013 team? Go back and check the number of times that Hammel broke up winning streaks of 3 or more. He and Jim Johnson cost us the playoffs that year.

Why not bring up Jim Johnson? Heck he just won NL pitcher of the month.

[pastorfan]

I think y'all are missing the OP's point, which is, I believe, that the Orioles' organizational philosophy regarding the cutter during DD's tenure has been hella dumb.

If so, I completely and enthusiastically agree.

Each time they got rid of a pitcher though (besides Gonzo) they really had no other choice. I mean those guys were just not getting anyone out. I'm sure they are concerned that a contender would catch lightning in a bottle with Ubaldo if they DFA him. Unfortunately it takes being cut to get some of these guys back on track.

Also, I am confused about the philosophy on the cutter. Bordick said on Saturday that Ordusak (sp?) had a great cutter. Is he throwing a cutter? Is it only some of the pitchers that are allowed to throw a cutter?

[Can_of_corn]

Each time they got rid of a pitcher though (besides Gonzo) they really had no other choice. I mean those guys were just not getting anyone out. I'm sure they are concerned that a contender would catch lightning in a bottle with Ubaldo if they DFA him. Unfortunately it takes being cut to get some of these guys back on track.

Also, I am confused about the philosophy on the cutter. Bordick said on Saturday that Ordusak (sp?) had a great cutter. Is he throwing a cutter? Is it only some of the pitchers that are allowed to throw a cutter?

The O's restrict the use of Cutters in the minors.

[DrungoHazewood]

Each time they got rid of a pitcher though (besides Gonzo) they really had no other choice. I mean those guys were just not getting anyone out. I'm sure they are concerned that a contender would catch lightning in a bottle with Ubaldo if they DFA him. Unfortunately it takes being cut to get some of these guys back on track.

Also, I am confused about the philosophy on the cutter. Bordick said on Saturday that Ordusak (sp?) had a great cutter. Is he throwing a cutter? Is it only some of the pitchers that are allowed to throw a cutter?

Orioles have had mixed success with developing pitchers, with some obvious failures. They have some kind of policy limiting the use of cutters in developing pitchers so they don't rely on that pitch at the expense of developing other pitches. Also for health reasons. But they also allow MLBers to throw cutters, like with Tillman. A handful of former Orioles may throw more cutters and have had some level of success.

The obvious and logical conclusion here is Orioles hella dumb.

[Redskins Rick]

Orioles have had mixed success with developing pitchers, with some obvious failures. They have some kind of policy limiting the use of cutters in developing pitchers so they don't rely on that pitch at the expense of developing other pitches. Also for health reasons. But they also allow MLBers to throw cutters, like with Tillman. A handful of former Orioles may throw more cutters and have had some level of success.

The obvious and logical conclusion here is Orioles hella dumb.

Every team has pitching failures, since only X% of the prospects have legitimate major league careers.

2006 Rockies with the 2rd pick and the 2006 Pirates with the 4th pick are just two 1st round pitchers that didn't amount to anything.

Pirates didn't do too well in 2007 either with their #4th pick

[Redskins Rick]

Orioles have had mixed success with developing pitchers, with some obvious failures. They have some kind of policy limiting the use of cutters in developing pitchers so they don't rely on that pitch at the expense of developing other pitches. Also for health reasons. But they also allow MLBers to throw cutters, like with Tillman. A handful of former Orioles may throw more cutters and have had some level of success.

The obvious and logical conclusion here is Orioles hella dumb.

I don't believe the Orioles are the only MLB organization that bans the cutter in the minor league.

[Ripken]

Jake is the only one I'd take back. And he was horrible here.

[Going Underground]

I don't believe the Orioles are the only MLB organization that bans the cutter in the minor league.

I heard it is near half.Some teams let you throw it as you progress through the system