Manny's extreme open stance is killing the O's

[El Gordo]

25 minutes ago, ORIOLE33 said:

To be hitting in the low 200's going into June, to get back up to respectability, he is going to have to go on a prolonged tear.

And he's never done that?

[SteveA]

10 hours ago, webbrick2010 said:

Swinging for the fences is the main problem, the open stance doesn't help

Is he that open because he isn't quick enough to handle inside pitches?

leaving him vulnerable to outside pitches.

He's getting a steady diet of breaking stuff on the outside corner and he is expanding the zone. Doesn't seem to be able to recognize the pitches, just like CD

This season he will regress in every offensive category, at the age of 24

Nick Markakis peaked at 25, and never approached his earlier prowess... it happens

Yeah, just like Bryce Harper did last year at the age of 23.

[wildcard]

5 hours ago, ReclaimTheCrown said:

This is an interesting topic, and it certainly makes you wonder how that stance may be affecting him.  So I pulled some tape and looked at a comparison from early last June against KC and this April against Boston (ironically easily pulled of the internet because they were both times when Manny was getting thrown at).  With apologies for not being able to post the screen caps from the video, his stance looks identical between those two games.  So the more closed stance must've been from earlier last year (likely April/May timeframe).  As someone pointed out, he did have his strongest months (1.061 OPS in April, .951 in May, .996 in June) so depending on when he did start messing with his stance, it could've had an impact.

At this rate this year, though, I'm willing to try just about anything.  Close that thang back up!

So what you are saying is the Palmer and Thorne provided misleading information about Manny's stance.  I can't speak to that one way or another but I think it would be unfair if they did that.   On the other hand if what they said is true I think it is valuable information.

[SteveA]

But on the bright side, he is leading AL 3rd basemen in All Star Voting.

[scOtt]

1 hour ago, Emory Eagle said:

It's not all that relevant how his stance starts out before the pitch is thrown, but if he's finishing open (i.e. "stepping in the bucket") then that might be an issue.  It's all about how the swing looks at the point of contact.  

In any case, the O's have a lot of bigger problems than batting stances at the moment.

This. Not where you start but where you are during the swing. A lot of the guys who use the open stance say it gives them a better view of the pitcher. Like you said, if he striding straight he's fine.

[ORIOLE33]

55 minutes ago, El Gordo said:

And he's never done that?

Not for a while.

[wildcard]

1 hour ago, Emory Eagle said:

It's not all that relevant how his stance starts out before the pitch is thrown, but if he's finishing open (i.e. "stepping in the bucket") then that might be an issue.  It's all about how the swing looks at the point of contact.  

In any case, the O's have a lot of bigger problems than batting stances at the moment.

Can't say that I agree with this.   Manny hitting for a 708 OPS as he is currently is a very big deal compared to him hitting for a 876 OPS has he did last year.  If he changed something his year, its not working.  I don't know if he did or didn't but Palmer seems to think he did.

[ReclaimTheCrown]

2 hours ago, wildcard said:

So what you are saying is the Palmer and Thorne provided misleading information about Manny's stance.  I can't speak to that one way or another but I think it would be unfair if they did that.   On the other hand if what they said is true I think it is valuable information.

Oh I'm not going to allege that. All I'm saying is that it looked to me like he had the same stance that he has this year as of early June 2016. I believe that he had a more closed stance earlier in the year, just that it looks like he opened it up more sometime mid last year. Heck, maybe he opened and then later closed the thing. 

[Emory Eagle]

3 hours ago, wildcard said:

Can't say that I agree with this.   Manny hitting for a 708 OPS as he is currently is a very big deal compared to him hitting for a 876 OPS has he did last year.  If he changed something his year, its not working.  I don't know if he did or didn't but Palmer seems to think he did.

Well certainly Manny's production is critical to the team. I just doubt that his struggles are related to his batting stance.   

[Pat Kelly]

Manny OPS now .694.

[Moshagge3]

5 minutes ago, Pat Kelly said:

Manny OPS now .694.

Can Kim play third?

[TheWall]

17 hours ago, birdwatcher55 said:

My thoughts: Machado is not a superstar and secondly the league has figured out how to get him out. Good player but certainly not worth the $30 mil someone is going to pay him in 2019.

So we're clear, you don't think a 7 win player is a superstar? He's put up 6.7, 7.1, 6.7 in his 3 full years so far. The going rate for 1 win is up to what...$7-$8 million. Do you really think he's "done" before his 25th Birthday. Frustration is fine, I'm sick of watching him hack too, but I'm not throwing in the towel on him after 2 bad months.

[vab]

It may or may not ever come out but I've got to believe there's something off the field that's got Manny distracted. It just doesn't make any sense that all of the sudden the league has figured him out with this much of a track record. Who has ever put up these kind of numbers at age 24 and then turned into what we have seen this year barring injury? 

[TheWall]

18 minutes ago, vab said:

It may or may not ever come out but I've got to believe there's something off the field that's got Manny distracted. It just doesn't make any sense that all of the sudden the league has figured him out with this much of a track record. Who has ever put up these kind of numbers at age 24 and then turned into what we have seen this year barring injury? 

Bryce Harper's value from 2015 to 2016 decreased by 7 wins. It's unlikely that Manny will end the season with something that extreme.

[TradeAngelos]

1 hour ago, TheWall said:

Bryce Harper's value from 2015 to 2016 decreased by 7 wins. It's unlikely that Manny will end the season with something that extreme.

Still on pace for 3.3 WAR and a value of almost 30m this year. How can we ever win again with this guy? And of course he won''t get hot or anything and probably bump that up to maybe 5 or so when all said and done. No chance.. He clearly is "declining" at 24 and has been all "smoke and mirrors" for the first 600 plus games and 2600 plus PA's of his career up until this year. I wouldn't be surprised if the kid is out of baseball in a few years. Joke will be on the Yankees when they sign him!