Doug Brocail is the Pitching Coach

[Cumberbundy]

37 minutes ago, TheOtherRipken said:

Would you consider that to mean you feel he is a poor pitching coach? I am struggling a little bit to see direct correlation.  

Honestly, looking at Rangers rotation I think it’s got to be one of the weakest in baseball. GMs fault or pitching coach’s fault?

Again not saying you are wrong, just not willing to jump to that conclusion. 

What I glean from the statistic is Doug doesn’t help pitchers miss bats — I posted the stat to show why fans in Arlington may have been frustrated. If our new pitching coach can help keep Bundy, Cobb, Scott, and Givens healthy, he’s fine by me. Elias must trust him to implement the things he wants implemented — his job will be to keep the staff engaged, keep their mechanics sound, and help Elias get his ideas into practice. 

Our staff will probably go through the 2nd year in about as bad a 2 year stretch as anyone in baseball will experience, I hope Doug is half coach, half psychologist. 

[jrobb21613]

It’s one thing to have a great mind and great ideas it’s another to be able to get players to by into it and execute it. So far it doesn’t appear Doug can do the latter. 

[orioles119]

3 hours ago, OsFanSinceThe80s said:

 

Choppin' Brocail-i 

[tntoriole]

3 hours ago, Moose Milligan said:

We hate every pitching coach unless they're turning our guys into the '71 Orioles.  Or take some pitcher with AAAA stuff and make them an all-star.  Because that's what a good pitching coach does, turns a turd into a filet.

The last pitching coach I liked was George Bamberger.  

[Palmoripken]

35 minutes ago, tntoriole said:

The last pitching coach I liked was George Bamberger.  

You didn't like Ray Miller? I thought he was good. Probably the best O's pitching coach of my lifetime. Granted '97 was one year but I remember it being night and day between the '96 team and the '97 team. The '96 team as I recall had a better offense but the '97 team was better on count of the pitching. Anyhow as for Brocail, we'll see what happens with him. I'm not expecting Cy Young winners. Just positive development.

[now]

4 minutes ago, Palmoripken said:

You didn't like Ray Miller? I thought he was good. Probably the best O's pitching coach of my lifetime. Granted '97 was one year but I remember it being night and day between the '96 team and the '97 team. The '96 team as I recall had a better offense but the '97 team was better on count of the pitching. Anyhow as for Brocail, we'll see what happens with him. I'm not expecting Cy Young winners. Just positive development.

Whereas Ray as manager... maybe my least favorite ever.

[Moose Milligan]

Firmly convinced the pitching coach doesn't matter unless we've got the talent.  Leo Mazzone was proof of that, that guy was an absolute fraud.  

[Frobby]

25 minutes ago, now said:

Whereas Ray as manager... maybe my least favorite ever.

I’d go Phil Regan.  

[waroriole]

4 hours ago, Moose Milligan said:

We hate every pitching coach unless they're turning our guys into the '71 Orioles.  Or take some pitcher with AAAA stuff and make them an all-star.  Because that's what a good pitching coach does, turns a turd into a filet.

Even then we hate him because he didn’t turn all the trash into gold. 

[Frobby]

30 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Firmly convinced the pitching coach doesn't matter unless we've got the talent.  Leo Mazzone was proof of that, that guy was an absolute fraud.  

Bedard and Guthrie thrived under him.   Lopez and Chen regressed badly.   

[Luke-OH]

2 hours ago, Legend_Of_Joey said:

If you want to know just how much the Rangers staff struggled, they signed Colon to anchor it, then had Lincicum and Tillman on contracts.

They did improve as a whole from 2015 (pre-Brocail) to 2016. Swing Strike% increased, K% increased, ERA-, FIP-, and xFIP- decreased. The only negative is BB% ticked up. They threw fewer FBs, which is a thing the Astros did the last few years under Lunhow/Elias as well. Although admittedly when he was a pitching coach for the Astros they threw a ton of FBs.

Season	Team	SwStr%	ERA-	FIP-	xFIP-	K%	BB%	FB%
2015	Rangers	8.40%	101	106	108	17.60%	8.20%	59.30%
2016	Rangers	9.50%	97	104	106	18.70%	8.60%	56.50%

[Moose Milligan]

Just now, Frobby said:

Bedard and Guthrie thrived under him.   Lopez and Chen regressed badly.   

Correct.  I'm convinced that Bedard and Guthrie would have turned out well.  Maybe Bedard doesn't turn out as good as he was for that short amount of time but I think he'd have been fine regardless of Leo or not.

But by and large I think we can agree that he was overall a failure here.  Only because the overall talent wasn't that good though.

[Frobby]

7 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Correct.  I'm convinced that Bedard and Guthrie would have turned out well.  Maybe Bedard doesn't turn out as good as he was for that short amount of time but I think he'd have been fine regardless of Leo or not.

But by and large I think we can agree that he was overall a failure here.  Only because the overall talent wasn't that good though.

Nobody could solve DCab.    Loewen hurt his elbow.  Benson hurt his elbow.   

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

1 hour ago, Moose Milligan said:

Firmly convinced the pitching coach doesn't matter unless we've got the talent.  Leo Mazzone was proof of that, that guy was an absolute fraud.  

Give me Maddux, Smoltz and Glavine I’ll get your team to the playoffs while drinking a six pack every game.

[wildcard]

Maybe Elias/Hyde like Brocail because Cashner had one of his best seasons with Brocail as pitching coach and they hope he can help him again.  That could mean Cashner gets traded in July and saves the O's 3m.