Losing Loewen?

[Enjoy Terror]

I understand all the posters saying he can do whatever he wants, but this seems VERY dishonest, the organization made a big mistake in giving him all this time to get himself right, extra training etc. I have to think they would NOT have done any of this if they didnt feel confident he was coming back. They should have released him right away and THEN resigned him. I wonder how much effect that Loewen performing well in instructional league had on Toronto's desire to sign him.

Obviously this is a rare situation, but I have to think this is the last time an organization makes this kind of concession for an ailing player.

Without the instructional league, the Orioles may not have any interest THEMSELVES to resign Loewen. He basically had to prove himself as a hitter somewhere, without the IL he wouldn't have done that.

[Enjoy Terror]

by the way, for those who think that loewen just wanted to be closer to home.....loewen's home town of surrey, british columbia is a 40-hour drive from toronto. It's more than 2,600 miles away.

hes a blue jays fan who cares where he lives

[nyjimbo]

Next thing we'll hear is that Luis Hernandez and Alex Cintron will be moving on. Sad day in Oriole land.

[SouthRider]

I guess some people will blame Angelos and the Orioles brass for anything, no matter how big a miscarriage of justice the player pulls on us.

I am not blaming Angelos one bit. The Orioles' brass, however, is completely culpable for putting the player in a position where he could leave. They took a risk and they lost, plain and simple. I guess risk management, like scouting and player development, is another skill this organization stinks at.

Perhaps you are correct and Loewen pulled the wool over MacPhail's eyes. Perhaps there is something here under the covers that we don't yet know. Hopefully our insiders can fill us all in on what really happened. Was there an agreement in place? Do the O's view Loewen's chances of a comeback to be so low that they washed their hands of him? I just think that if the O's do think Loewen can be a productive major leaguer then they allowed a precious asset to get away, and that my friend is inexcusable.

[Icterus galbula]

Ha, there is enough talk in this thread about "moving on" and Loewen being "dead to me" that google is giving me an obituary advertisement at the top of the page.

[Gaz]

Wow, that's a crappy thing to do. The O's sure got screwed over in this mess.

BTW-Since he's from the west coast, aren't the Mariners closer to being his hometown team than Toronto!? That's an odd reason IMO but maybe its just that he followed the Canadian baseball teams instead.

It's more about playing for a team in his home country then playing for the team closest to his home town. It happens all the time in the NHL. Americans are offered contracts to play for a team in Canada and choose to stay in the US. I can understand why everyone is upset, but I also understand Adam's reason for leaving.

[Enjoy Terror]

This was a small risk we chanced. Loewen is supposed to play 1B or OF. In all seriousness, do you see room for Loewen on this team in the next five years?

I mean, you all would like to see Jones and Markakis extended, right? If not Luke Scott, then Reimold or Montanez right? Where's Loewen in all that?

I bet the Blue Jays have tons of room out there for him.

This doesn't even mean anything other than he gets a shot in A-level minor league ball; he's not a sure thing to ever make the MLB again, and if he does... it's another risk the Jays were willing to accept. I'm not sure the risk of paying Loewen another million to keep him around would have been worth it.

[hoosiers]

This has the earmark of a long-term vendetta. I doubt it stops with Burnett. The right people are really steamed.

Are you referring to the people who manage the 40 man roster? My guess is they should be looking in the mirror.

Not happy at all about losing Loewen - one of my favorite Os since even before the 2002 draft. If he sniffs the majors as a hitter, I'll be very upset at our FO.

[ledzepp8]

I don't know what to think. In the end it probably amounts to nothing because Loewen most likely won't make it back as a hitter. But it does seem kind of classless on his part considering he had a "gentleman's agreement" with the O's who bent over backwards to help put him in a position to make the switch. And it's also kind of classless on the Jays part to swoop in like they did when they had to have known what was going on. I mean it's there prerogative to do it, but it definitely taints their character.

[ledzepp8]

Are you referring to the people who manage the 40 man roster? My guess is they should be looking in the mirror.

Not happy at all about losing Loewen - one of my favorite Os since even before the 2002 draft. If he sniffs the majors as a hitter, I'll be very upset at our FO.

Why would you be upset with them? It's obvious to me that promises were made to the Orioles and Loewen chose to go back on them. This is all on him. What should MacPhail have done? Make him fulfill his promise and resign with us?

[laxtonto]

This is one of the possible outcomes of putting a former 1st round pick through waivers to take him off the 40 man roster. There are no guarantees after letting anyone get through waivers.

I'm more surprised with the timing of the move to put him on waivers than anything else. I would have expected a move like this instead around the rule 5 draft when teams are less apt to snap up minor league FAs.

Yes he decided to go to Tor on a minor league deal. He made the choice that he felt would be best for his long term goal. To make the Majors. Can you really fault him if he sees that future in another uniform because of the current makeup of the minor league levels and MLB team above him here with the O's. Adding to it the chance to be involved with the only ML team affiliated with Canada,his home country, would only be icing on the cake so to speak in his decision.

Good luck, no hard feelings, hope you do well....

[TonySoprano]

What does Burnett have to do with it? He already let it be known he was opting out and would become a free agent. We were going to bid on him in any event, or we weren't. What are we going to do now, make sure we outbid the Blue Jays just to spite them? He either makes sense for us or he doesn't, and the fact that the Jays grabbed Loewen shouldn't influence that judgment one iota.

But while we're on the subject, I didn't hear anyone here complaining about the fact that Burnett was opting out of his deal and was interested in comng to play in Baltimore because his family lives here. The Jays paid him a lot of money the last three years, including a significant amount in yers in which he was injured a good bit of the time. Why is nobody here morally outraged at Burnett's decision?

He hasn't made that decision yet. Maybe he will opt out, but it's not a done deal.

But the club isn't getting far with the first to-do on its winter list, re-signing Burnett.

"They're not going bad, they're not going good. They're fine," Ricciardi said of his conversations with Burnett's agent.

That agent, Darek Braunecker, said Monday his client is no closer to deciding whether to exercise the opt-out clause in his contract.

"I don't think he's in any hurry to make an announcement either way," Braunecker said. Burnett has until 15 days after the end of the World Series to decide if he wants to become a free agent.

According to Braunecker, the Jays have as yet made no offer "either official or unofficial" to his client. But Braunecker has already said he will not hold substantive talks until Burnett has made his decision.

There is some indication of how Burnett is sizing up the market. He sees himself somewhere between the other elite free-agent starters likely to enter the market this winter, Derek Lowe of the Dodgers and Milwaukee's CC Sabathia.

"You frame A.J. between those two players, quite frankly," Braunecker said. "Derek Lowe could make a whole, whole lot of money this winter. And A.J. Burnett should make more."

Source - Toronto Star, Oct 24

[Frobby]

He hasn't made that decision yet. Maybe he will opt out, but it's not a done deal. Source - Toronto Star, Oct 24

Fair enough. Put it this way - loyalty to the Blue Jays isn't going to enter into it.

[ccbird]

Why would you be upset with them? It's obvious to me that promises were made to the Orioles and Loewen chose to go back on them. This is all on him. What should MacPhail have done? Make him fulfill his promise and resign with us?

Somebody needs to fill me in. How could we have kept him anyway?? I assume some people wanted him on the 40 man roster but was that possible without paying him by his big league contract. Even if that was possible I don't see how taking a risk on him was the best use of one of our 40 man spots.

[hoosiers]

Why would you be upset with them? It's obvious to me that promises were made to the Orioles and Loewen chose to go back on them. This is all on him.

I guess we'll see if "promises were made".

I would expect the Os let AL know of their plans for him and why they were doing what they were doing. If there were a commitment from AL to follow that plan, then, yes, this would mostly be on AL.

All the same, this is eerily reminiscent of the organization nearly losing Chris Gomez to the Phillies on a technicality and exposing Josh Phelps in the Rule V draft. It's one thing to put your top 40 best players, giving some consideration to lesser players at important or underserved positions, on your 40 man roster, and it is another thing to play these shenanigans in trying to squeeze a couple guys "around' the 40 man. Our FO is always trying to play these cute, little games and it always seems to bite us in the butt. If our FO is really mad at losing Loewen, then they obviously made a serious mistake in trying to figure a way to keep him in the organization without his taking up a roster spot.

Regarding people saying Loewen owes us for time/investment spent trying to convert him to a hitter, I say bologna. What did Loewen really get? At-bats in instructional league and a week or so with Crow? Anyone here really consider that a major investment? I sure don't. He'll probably receive just as much instruction from high level advisors within his first two months with the Blue Jays. I'm not happy he left, but he does not owe the Orioles anything other than some loyalty for being the organization that drafted him and looked out for his best interests in the time we was our property.