2024 Ongoing Lineup Thread

[gtman55]

7 minutes ago, LookitsPuck said:

At this point, if the ship is going to go down and they somehow completely crash and burn, do it with the guys that will help you next year and get them valuable experience. Losing w/ Eloy, Maton, Soto, and Rivera just stinks. 

I think a lot of us feel the same. 

[Yossarian]

1 hour ago, ShoelesJoe said:

Ouch.  The bottom 6 in that lineup just don't put a lot of fear into a pitcher lately 

[RZNJ]

1 hour ago, LookitsPuck said:

Agree 100%. At this point, if the ship is going to go down and they somehow completely crash and burn, do it with the guys that will help you next year and get them valuable experience. Losing w/ Eloy, Maton, Soto, and Rivera just stinks. 

At this point I’m inclined to agree.   Play Mayo everyday at 3B, Holliday at 2B and Kjerstad at DH and see what happens.   Can’t get much worse.   

[Moose Milligan]

At least Mayo is playing!

[Spy Fox]

 

[Brooks The Great]

Last night's lineup was Hyde first decent lineup in a long time, but tonight's lineup is another abysmal one from him.

If Elias was going to make a dumpster dive trade for Austin Slater, I can somewhat see the logic behind strictly using Slater as a platoon player. But I definitely don't understand giving him more starts against righties. What both Elias and Hyde are saying by giving Slater opportunities is, "We don't care about stats or splits, we have a good feeling about this guy." That's it, and that's terrible roster management. 

Slater has extreme favorable career splits against lefties, and the Elias apologists on this board pointed to Slater being a good platoon matchup hitter against lefties, saying he makes some sense if you believe his struggles against lefties this season would normalize closer to his career line. Yet Slater is still actually hitting better against righties this season. Ultimately, in the end, Slater is a .600 OPS hitter overall this season. Which makes him unplayable to any competent manager or GM. There was a reason Slater was available at the trade deadline for cash considerations. And it's because he sucks.

Emmanuel Rivera, meanwhile, has a .597 OPS this season. Sorry, not even a gold glove 3B is worth rostering with that kind of bat. Yet Hyde continues to give Rivera at bats over a top 10 prospect who should be getting as many starts as possible to get comfortable. Unbelievable. 

Slater and Rivera could each hit a home run tonight, and that still wouldn't change how terrible they are or that it's bad lineup optimization to start both of these bums. 

[bpilktree67]

18 minutes ago, Brooks The Great said:

Last night's lineup was Hyde first decent lineup in a long time, but tonight's lineup is another abysmal one from him.

If Elias was going to make a dumpster dive trade for Austin Slater, I can somewhat see the logic behind strictly using Slater as a platoon player. But I definitely don't understand giving him more starts against righties. What both Elias and Hyde are saying by giving Slater opportunities is, "We don't care about stats or splits, we have a good feeling about this guy." That's it, and that's terrible roster management. 

Slater has extreme favorable career splits against lefties, and the Elias apologists on this board pointed to Slater being a good platoon matchup hitter against lefties, saying he makes some sense if you believe his struggles against lefties this season would normalize closer to his career line. Yet Slater is still actually hitting better against righties this season. Ultimately, in the end, Slater is a .600 OPS hitter overall this season. Which makes him unplayable to any competent manager or GM. There was a reason Slater was available at the trade deadline for cash considerations. And it's because he sucks.

Emmanuel Rivera, meanwhile, has a .597 OPS this season. Sorry, not even a gold glove 3B is worth rostering with that kind of bat. Yet Hyde continues to give Rivera at bats over a top 10 prospect who should be getting as many starts as possible to get comfortable. Unbelievable. 

Slater and Rivera could each hit a home run tonight, and that still wouldn't change how terrible they are or that it's bad lineup optimization to start both of these bums. 

So he has the same first 6 hitters and plays Rivera over Mayo who has hit better and is a much better defender along with playing Slater in the outfield which gives us better defense over Santander and takes McCann a light hitting catcher out of the game.  So he made an upgrade at 3rd base with how both guys are playing and flipped Slater for McCann and thus makes it an awful lineup.  It makes me laugh how much people get upset about nothing.  

[LookitsPuck]

I think it's because Pivetta has reverse splits this year. Now, do you value his career numbers or this year...I'm not sure. But maybe SIGBOT cares about this year more maybe because of pitch mix/effectiveness can vary year to year. Who knows.

• Against righties: .279/.311/.514 - .825 OPS
• Lefties: .187/.251/.365 - .616 OPS

 

[HowAboutThat]

Elias overestimated Mayo’s value. A guy who strikes out a lot and has no defense is not a valuable prospect, even if he’s strong as a bear and can hit balls to the moon.

I wish had been traded at peak value, and yes, I would be happy to trade Holliday, too, but his value has gone down as well

[SteveA]

21 minutes ago, LookitsPuck said:

I think it's because Pivetta has reverse splits this year. Now, do you value his career numbers or this year...I'm not sure. But maybe SIGBOT cares about this year more maybe because of pitch mix/effectiveness can vary year to year. Who knows.

• Against righties: .279/.311/.514 - .825 OPS
• Lefties: .187/.251/.365 - .616 OPS

 

Yep.   Factoring in the reverse splits, and the fact that Hyde seems to like to give Anthony a day off from the outfield in each series, and we are in a stretch where we aren't seeing any lefties, he found a spot to give one of his bench guys a start.

[Aristotelian]

1 hour ago, Brooks The Great said:

Last night's lineup was Hyde first decent lineup in a long time, but tonight's lineup is another abysmal one from him.

If Elias was going to make a dumpster dive trade for Austin Slater, I can somewhat see the logic behind strictly using Slater as a platoon player. But I definitely don't understand giving him more starts against righties. What both Elias and Hyde are saying by giving Slater opportunities is, "We don't care about stats or splits, we have a good feeling about this guy." That's it, and that's terrible roster management. 

Slater has extreme favorable career splits against lefties, and the Elias apologists on this board pointed to Slater being a good platoon matchup hitter against lefties, saying he makes some sense if you believe his struggles against lefties this season would normalize closer to his career line. Yet Slater is still actually hitting better against righties this season. Ultimately, in the end, Slater is a .600 OPS hitter overall this season. Which makes him unplayable to any competent manager or GM. There was a reason Slater was available at the trade deadline for cash considerations. And it's because he sucks.

Emmanuel Rivera, meanwhile, has a .597 OPS this season. Sorry, not even a gold glove 3B is worth rostering with that kind of bat. Yet Hyde continues to give Rivera at bats over a top 10 prospect who should be getting as many starts as possible to get comfortable. Unbelievable. 

Slater and Rivera could each hit a home run tonight, and that still wouldn't change how terrible they are or that it's bad lineup optimization to start both of these bums. 

Mayo got two games in a row and did nothing with the opportunity. Rivera is a better 3B and so far is out hitting Mayo. If Mayo want that to change, he is going to have to hit.

We don't have a good DH option with Mountcastle out so upgrading the defense is not a bad idea. The alternative there is probably Jimenez. I have no problem with Slater/Santander vs Santander/Jimenez and keep Santander fresh.

[Moose Milligan]

48 minutes ago, HowAboutThat said:

Elias overestimated Mayo’s value. A guy who strikes out a lot and has no defense is not a valuable prospect, even if he’s strong as a bear and can hit balls to the moon.

I wish had been traded at peak value, and yes, I would be happy to trade Holliday, too, but his value has gone down as well

 

[bpilktree67]

53 minutes ago, HowAboutThat said:

Elias overestimated Mayo’s value. A guy who strikes out a lot and has no defense is not a valuable prospect, even if he’s strong as a bear and can hit balls to the moon.

I wish had been traded at peak value, and yes, I would be happy to trade Holliday, too, but his value has gone down as well

Has all of baseball overestimated his value?  Every scout and publication says he is top 20 prospect in all of baseball and lots of teams wanted him in trades.  

[Sports Guy]

1 hour ago, HowAboutThat said:

Elias overestimated Mayo’s value. A guy who strikes out a lot and has no defense is not a valuable prospect, even if he’s strong as a bear and can hit balls to the moon.

I wish had been traded at peak value, and yes, I would be happy to trade Holliday, too, but his value has gone down as well

[Brooks The Great]

52 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Mayo got two games in a row and did nothing with the opportunity. Rivera is a better 3B and so far is out hitting Mayo. If Mayo want that to change, he is going to have to hit.

We don't have a good DH option with Mountcastle out so upgrading the defense is not a bad idea. The alternative there is probably Jimenez. I have no problem with Slater/Santander vs Santander/Jimenez and keep Santander fresh.

Two games in a row is absolutely nothing. And benching him as much as Hyde does could very possibly be contributing to his slow start, as he might not be able to get comfortable, might feel extra pressure to hit, or both. 

Elite prospects with bats like Mayo's absolutely need to play every day. Not be treated like some sort of part-time bench player vet. Gunnar and Adley struggled for about 2 months each prior to settling in, but they played every day and that helped them. Same needs to be done with Mayo.