What did DT do wrong tonight?

[El Gordo]

What's with the brash insults there, El Gordo? Were they warranted?

Personally, I don't think it was a no brainer. You do. I choose not to go off of 25 at bats to judge a person's on base capabilities against right handed pitchers, or even, more specifically, "tough righties". What's Zaun's OBP against tough righties? :rofl:

If you consider my opinion, that to think it a nobrainer is to to be lacking one, is a brash insult you are even more touchy than I thought, Capt. Queeg. If I were to give you an example of a brash insult, I would be taking a vacation. However my point is, that it is not a no brainer to bat Reimold, that there are reasons for PHing Zaun. To say that, is not too say, batting Zuan is the best or even the right choice, just that a reasonable argument can be made for batting him in that situation. Certainly the decision was not egregious enough to warrant firing him as others have suggested.

[LookitsPuck]

If you consider my opinion, that to think it a nobrainer is to to be lacking one, is a brash insult you are even more touchy than I thought, Capt. Queeg. If I were to give you an example of a brash insult, I would be taking a vacation. However my point is, that it is not a no brainer to bat Reimold, that there are reasons for PHing Zaun. To say that, is not too say, batting Zuan is the best or even the right choice, just that a reasonable argument can be made for batting him in that situation. Certainly the decision was not egregious enough to warrant firing him as others have suggested.

I'd say it'd be fairly...dumb for Trembley to not pinch hit Reimold in this case due to 25 at bats against "tough righties". To prefer Zaun's awe-inspiring .302 OBP for Reimold because he can "get on base" is just ridiculous. A home run ties the game at that point. Zaun gets on base, and then what happens? Andino/Izturis? I have real faith in those guys. I like Izturis just fine, but I have more faith in Reimold hitting a bomb than Zaun getting on base AND THEN Izturis coming through. How often does Izturis get on base? Answer: worse than Zaun.

BTW, telling someone that they have no brain because they're using a different approach is just typical El Gordo, folks. El Gordo is always right, so if he defends Trembley, Trembley is always right. Nothing to see here. Carry on.

[sector7g]

Not to mention, with a runner on, should we really be looking to get Zaun on so Andino or Izturis can come up?

Apparently, yes we should

Look even if you leave Zaun in there (which you shouldn't in my opinion - home run ties the freaking game) you have to hit Reimold ahead of Izturis leading off the 9th. You wouldn't need Reimold to pinch hit for anyone else and there is absolutely no doubt he had more chance of getting on base than Izturis.

Doesn't mean DT is an idiot, but I don't think he made the right percentage call on either move there.

[LookitsPuck]

Apparently, yes we should

Look even if you leave Zaun in there (which you shouldn't in my opinion - home run ties the freaking game) you have to hit Reimold ahead of Izturis leading off the 9th. You wouldn't need Reimold to pinch hit for anyone else and there is absolutely no doubt he had more chance of getting on base than Izturis.

Doesn't mean DT is an idiot, but I don't think he made the right percentage call on either move there.

Everything you said here is on point. Rep to you.

[sector7g]

If you consider my opinion, that to think it a nobrainer is to to be lacking one, is a brash insult you are even more touchy than I thought, Capt. Queeg. If I were to give you an example of a brash insult, I would be taking a vacation. However my point is, that it is not a no brainer to bat Reimold, that there are reasons for PHing Zaun. To say that, is not too say, batting Zuan is the best or even the right choice, just that a reasonable argument can be made for batting him in that situation. Certainly the decision was not egregious enough to warrant firing him as others have suggested.

Who said that he should be fired for not pinch hitting Reimold? It's not in this thread.

[El Gordo]

Err...he'd already pitched the previous inning....giving up 2 hits, one run and a deep fly out.

Look you don't have to defend DT for everything, even the best managers don't make the perfect calls each time.

DT doesn't post here. So he can't give his reasons for his decisions. I don't think it's fun bashing him without getting his poit of view. I am sorry someone with more baseball savy than me, can't try to make arguments for him. But just bashing him without any response seems to me very boring. I guess it does make some people feel better about themselves, for a few seconds.

[LookitsPuck]

Who said that he should be fired for not pinch hitting Reimold? It's not in this thread.

It's El Gordo's "Jump to Conclusions" mat.

[El Gordo]

I'd say it'd be fairly...dumb for Trembley to not pinch hit Reimold in this case due to 25 at bats against "tough righties". To prefer Zaun's awe-inspiring .302 OBP for Reimold because he can "get on base" is just ridiculous. A home run ties the game at that point. Zaun gets on base, and then what happens? Andino/Izturis? I have real faith in those guys. I like Izturis just fine, but I have more faith in Reimold hitting a bomb than Zaun getting on base AND THEN Izturis coming through. How often does Izturis get on base? Answer: worse than Zaun.

BTW, telling someone that they have no brain because they're using a different approach is just typical El Gordo, folks. El Gordo is always right, so if he defends Trembley, Trembley is always right. Nothing to see here. Carry on.

I see the problem. We are talking about two different games. I was talking about the one where we were down 0-3 in the 8th with 2 out and a man on 2B. A HR wouldn't have tied the game at that point. If Zaun gets on then bat Reimold. A HR would tie the game then. BTW Zaun's OBPO is .312. not .302 I'm sure the difference matters to him. :laughlol:

[sector7g]

DT doesn't post here. So he can't give his reasons for his decisions. I don't think it's fun bashing him without getting his point of view. I am sorry someone with more baseball savy than me, can't try to make arguments for him. But just bashing him without any response seems to me very boring. I guess it does make some people feel better about themselves, for a few seconds.

Given your motives, it seems to me that this thread was a terrible idea.

[LookitsPuck]

I see the problem. We are talking about two different games. I was talking about the one where we were down 0-3 in the 8th with 2 out and a man on 2B. A HR wouldn't have tied the game at that point. If Zaun gets on then bat Reimold. A HR would tie the game then. BTW Zaun's OBPO is .312. not .302 I'm sure the difference matters to him. :laughlol:

His OBP is .302 against righties.....

[El Gordo]

Who said that he should be fired for not pinch hitting Reimold? It's not in this thread.

" If DT even considered OBP vs. righties as a reason to put Zaun up there over Reimold he should be fired."

He said using OBP as a reason to bat Zaun over Reimold should warrant firing him. Do you agree with that?

[sector7g]

" If DT even considered OBP vs. righties as a reason to put Zaun up there over Reimold he should be fired."

He said using OBP as a reason to bat Zaun over Reimold should warrant firing him. Do you agree with that?

Remember, you just realized you were talking about the wrong game in your posts. A home run ties the game (which I assume the other poster knew) so OBP wouldn't be the most productive tool there when you compare the respective slugging of Reimold and Zaun.

[CrimsonTribe]

Let's all be honest here. Essentially, this thread is really just a dramatic stand against the use of hyperbole on a message board. Good luck with that fight.

[El Gordo]

Let's all be honest here. Essentially, this thread is really just a dramatic stand against the use of hyperbole on a message board. Good luck with that fight.

That is part of it, but I really think it's interesting to discuss questionable choices that a manager makes. It just seems to me it can be done thouhtfully, without people choosing sides, beating their virtual(my suspicion is the real ones ain't so much) hairy chests, and calling DT and peolpe who agree with him stupid, etc.

[El Gordo]

Given your motives, it seems to me that this thread was a terrible idea.

My motives? What ulterior motives do you suppose I have? I believe I have made my self very clear about this thread. I think it's interesting, and for the sake of accuracy over hyberbole, to dicuss DT's mnanging choices game by game. I like talking about baseball and "stratergy". I really dislike postering and baloney. What's sinsister about that? I think if you were to look over this thread you would find very few instances where you can find no reasonable explanation for a move that DT made. That's not to say they aren't questionable in terms of being the best moves, or the only moves, or whatever, it is only to say that DT rarely makes moves that make no sense. So caling him names like stupid, or clueless, saying he is a poor in game manager, or bullpen manager, or wharever, is just mindless posturing, I MO and not to the point.