Padres asking price for Adrian Gonzalez

[jdouble777]

If that's the cost, I think the Orioles have to kick the tires on it. The only other possibility would be to wait for Fielder to become a FA next year. That might be a better route, but I have no idea if AM will go after him.

That would be zero cheap years and cost a first round draft pick, A Gonz is two cheap years and a package

[jdouble777]

Well that's what the OP was getting at.

The Sox don't have the ML ready talent that the Orioles do.

Tillman, Arrieta/Erbe and Felix Pie for example would be more valuable IMO than a package the Sox could put together because they can all help SD next year.

Casey Kelly is going to pitch full time for the first time next season in A ball. Westmoreland is at least two years away.

Pie can slide into CF now, Tillman can slot into the rotation. Arrieta or Erbe could slide into their bullpen.

Let us not forget the Randy Johnson / Curt Schilling World Series, there is more or less enough to stack up with the AL East in terms of lineup. Pitching, not even worth a discussion. We need pitching. Weiters, Reimold, Jones, Pie, Roberts, Markakis can amass runs, that is a done deal, but there is only a big huge question mark when it comes to those runs translating into wins. Berg, DH, Tillman, Matusz, Arrieta equal a lot of shots at finding a couple guys that can make that question mark dissolve.

[Roll Tide]

Seems to me that's a game of keep-away the O's can't afford to play, let alone lose. Our prospects are a lot more valuable to us than those of the Red Sox are to the Red Sox. Plus, the money it'd take to make the deal worthwhile to the O's in the long term doesn't come as easily to us as it does to the likes of Boston.

Besides...I really don't think AGon going to the Sox spells the difference between the O's competing or not-competing within the division over the next several years. Boston's offense, even with AGon, doesn't scare me that much...

(taking for granted that Bay goes elsewhere)

If your under the impression that the Orioles are cash strapped you are mistaken. Peter has been pocketing Millions since 1998. We have added MASN which despite what you might think is making a profit, while not part of the Orioles the chief profiteer is no other than Angelos.

The Orioles could pay Gonzalez the same contract they offered Tex & still have plenty of room to manuever.

[MrOrange82]

If your under the impression that the Orioles are cash strapped you are mistaken. Peter has been pocketing Millions since 1998. We have added MASN which despite what you might think is making a profit, while not part of the Orioles the chief profiteer is no other than Angelos.

The Orioles could pay Gonzalez the same contract they offered Tex & still have plenty of room to manuever.

Not being cash-strapped =/= having financial resources that equate to those of the Boston Red Sox. Nowhere in my comments did I imply Peter Angelos suffers from shallow pockets.

[Roll Tide]

He has been this ONCE IN HIS CAREER!

Quit acting as if last year was the freaking normal season for AGon!!!!

To be fair he does have 106 Homers (35 Homers avg per season) & 318 Rbis (106 average). The Orioles havent had a hitter of that caliper since Tejada's early days as a Oriole. Thats the production we need. He instantly makes the guys around him in the order better. Its going to take quality to get quality. Many keep saying keep all the pitching. A good percentage of those guys are going to miss. We need trade some while their value is high (you know before they bust)

[jdouble777]

If your under the impression that the Orioles are cash strapped you are mistaken. Peter has been pocketing Millions since 1998. We have added MASN which despite what you might think is making a profit, while not part of the Orioles the chief profiteer is no other than Angelos.

The Orioles could pay Gonzalez the same contract they offered Tex & still have plenty of room to manuever.

Consider this: The Yankee brand (the portion of the team's value attributable to its name) alone is worth $241 million, almost as much as the entire Florida Marlins franchise. When the Yankees move into their new stadium in 2009 the team will be worth at least $1.5 billion because of the rich bounty of sponsorship and premium seating revenue.

The Mets, currently ranked second with a value of $824 million, will also get a new stadium that should push their value close to $1 billion before long. Citigroup (nyse: C - news - people ), beleaguered by the housing market meltdown, is still planning to pay the Amazins $400 million over 20 years for the stadium's naming rights.

When it comes to players, owners are becoming more tight-fisted. During the past five seasons, player costs (salaries, bonuses and benefits) have fallen to 56% of revenue from 66%. As a result, operating income (in the sense of earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation and amortization) averaged over $16 million per team for the second straight year.

Five years ago, 16 teams lost money. In 2007 only three teams--Blue Jays ($1.8 million), Red Sox ($19.1 million), Yankees ($47.3 million)--posted an operating loss. But even those losses are misleading. For the owners of the Yankees and Red Sox, the huge dividends they get from their unconsolidated cable networks more than make up for the teams' losses. Meanwhile Rogers Communications (nyse: RCI - news - people ), which owns the Blue Jays, their stadium and the cable channel that televises its games, derives huge benefits from owning the Blue Jays not reflected on its team's P&L statement.

On the field, the Arizona Diamondbacks and Colorado Rockies were the Cinderella stories last season. But the blueprint for how to operate a franchise in a small market is the Cleveland Indians, who have shown that a team can win on and off the field if they invest wisely in player development and have good chemistry on the diamond. In 2006, the Indians won only 78 games. Last season, not only did the Tribe eliminate the Yankees in the playoffs but they generated $29 million in operating income, third-most in the American League.

http://www.forbes.com/2008/04/16/baseball-team-values-biz-sports-baseball08-cx_mo_kb_0416baseballintro.html

Is this the O's in 2010, 2011, 2012?

[jdouble777]

Here is a great breakdown of last year's revenues, operating costs, payroll

http://www.fantasybaseballcafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=238635

Top 10 MLB Revenues (MILL):

264 New York Yankees

201 Boston Red Sox

180 New York Mets

173 Seattle Mariners

170 Chicago Cubs

167 Philadelphia Phillies

166 Los Angeles Dodgers

162 Atlanta Braves

159 San Francisco Giants

155 Houston Astros

Bottom 5 MLB Revenues:

107 Toronto Blue Jays

104 Kansas City Royals

103 Florida Marlins

102 Minnesota Twins

80 Washington Nationals

[Great 2BA FL Gator]

Pitching is what is going to give us a shot to compete. We need to let our pitching shake out, then we can make a nice deal for a CI once we know what we have with our pitching. Keep stockpiling the arms Andy.. Pitching wins folks.

[jdouble777]

Pitching is what is going to give us a shot to compete. We need to let our pitching shake out, then we can make a nice deal for a CI once we know what we have with our pitching. Keep stockpiling the arms Andy.. Pitching wins folks.

Well said, we need arms that are not going to turn D Trem into

[wildbillhiccup]

Pitching is what is going to give us a shot to compete. We need to let our pitching shake out, then we can make a nice deal for a CI once we know what we have with our pitching. Keep stockpiling the arms Andy.. Pitching wins folks.

...and what if our pitching doesn't pan out?

[wildbillhiccup]

He has been this ONCE IN HIS CAREER!

Quit acting as if last year was the freaking normal season for AGon!!!!

You can quip all you want about not wanting to trade our young pitchers, but when you start questioning A-Gon's value you really start to lose your creditability. A-Gon, posted the numbers he did last season in a 1) pitchers park and with 2) absolutely no protection around him in the lineup. Imagine what he could do even in a mediocre lineup.

[Roll Tide]

Here is a great breakdown of last year's revenues, operating costs, payroll

http://www.fantasybaseballcafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=238635

Top 10 MLB Revenues (MILL):

264 New York Yankees

201 Boston Red Sox

180 New York Mets

173 Seattle Mariners

170 Chicago Cubs

167 Philadelphia Phillies

166 Los Angeles Dodgers

162 Atlanta Braves

159 San Francisco Giants

155 Houston Astros

Bottom 5 MLB Revenues:

107 Toronto Blue Jays

104 Kansas City Royals

103 Florida Marlins

102 Minnesota Twins

80 Washington Nationals

Yes ....I dont argue that the Orioles are not currently in the top ten. But a good part of the reason is the attendance is in the toilet. They need to spark team interest to bring the casual & fair weather fans back to the ball park. The Orioles seemed to announce attendances in the mid 20,000s every night even though it was obvious that there were less than 10,000. While you still get the ticket revenue when paid fans no show you still lose the concessions on those fans. Not too mention the team wouldnt need those college nights, Kids specials & stuff where they sell tickets for $5-10 or inlcude all you can eat Soda & hot dogs to tickets. The can draw 30,000 fans per game. This makes a huge difference.

Also Im not sure you read my post all the way

1) Angelos had went on the cheap in the late 90's. Hes been stuffing money away ever since.

2) He is a rich sports team owner with large revenue streams from the law firm that he can spend if he chose to do so.

3 ) Masn has reported to have made $100 plus million per my recollection when it was reported by WNST on the radio. Thats in a down economy, with 2 piss poor baseball teams & advertisers spending very little. And fan interest pretty low.

[jdouble777]

...and what if our pitching doesn't pan out?

What if A Gon gets hurt? Right now, I would hope the conversations would stay focused on the arms panning out.

[wildbillhiccup]

What if A Gon gets hurt? Right now, I would hope the conversations would stay focused on the arms panning out.

Hate to break it to you, but the odds of A-Gon getting hurt are much less then the odds of all of our pitchers panning out. Stop looking at it through orange tinted glasses.

[Camden_yardbird]

Hate to break it to you, but the odds of A-Gon getting hurt are much less then the odds of all of our pitchers panning out. Stop looking at it through orange tinted glasses.

Well if that is not the biggest strawman I have ever seen...

The point is that not all of them will pan out, but you have to let some of them pan out with the Orioles.

Notice the Rays didn't start trading pitching until they had 3 solid young starters. Notice the A's also don't start trading pitchers until they have 3 solid young pitchers.

Right now the Orioles have ZERO young pitchers to stabilize a rotation that are established. They can't afford to play guessing games at which ones will pan out.