Over a week ago the O's were reportedly "aggressive" in the free agent market...

[Sports Guy]

You believe what you want to believe. You have a narrative crafted in which you are smarter than the FO and you enjoy it too much to spoil it with reality.

Here are the reports of teams meeting with players on MLBTR:

White Sox and Dunn, Nationals and De La Rosa, Yankees and Rangers with Lee, Marlins and Javier Vazquez. And the Tigers and Joaquin Benoit, since they signed him.

Wow! Orioles, falling behind the curve! Not to mention that I don't want the Orioles in on any of those four players.

Oh and you aren't, right? LOL :rofl:

And what reality should I be happy about? That we have seen some vague reports about who we like and that we have talked to teams?

I am happy about that. I am happy that they have called about Hardy. He has been a target of mine since last offseason.

[SrMeowMeow]

Oh and you aren't, right? LOL :rofl:

And what reality should I be happy about? That we have seen some vague reports about who we like and that we have talked to teams?

I am happy about that. I am happy that they have called about Hardy. He has been a target of mine since last offseason.

And, of course, we come full circle. The Orioles are doing or not doing plenty of stuff. We don't really know. Indications are that they're doing as much as or more than most other teams. If you want to judge the Orioles in a vacuum, be my guest. I prefer reality, and fairness, and rationality to rabble-rousing.

I'd love to see you at a baseball game. "Wow, the Orioles suck! They haven't even scored double digit runs!" "Actually, the average team only scores four or five runs a game and the O's have eight...they're actually doing very well." "Oh come on, after 13 years of losing you're going to equivocate like that? It's not about what other teams are doing, it's about what the Orioles are doing. And right now, they're not scoring 100 runs. Another check-minus for MacPhail!"

Think that's not an exact analogy? It is.

[Frobby]

This thread strikes me as pointless. I don't expect anything much to happen until after the arbitration date of December 1. The O's have talked with the Twins and Rays about trades, and they seem to be talking to agents for players. That's all I really expected by now.

[Sports Guy]

And, of course, we come full circle. The Orioles are doing or not doing plenty of stuff. We don't really know. Indications are that they're doing as much as or more than most other teams. If you want to judge the Orioles in a vacuum, be my guest. I prefer reality, and fairness, and rationality to rabble-rousing.

I'd love to see you at a baseball game. "Wow, the Orioles suck! They haven't even scored double digit runs!" "Actually, the average team only scores four or five runs a game and the O's have eight...they're actually doing very well." "Oh come on, after 13 years of losing you're going to equivocate like that? It's not about what other teams are doing, it's about what the Orioles are doing. And right now, they're not scoring 100 runs. Another check-minus for MacPhail!"

Think that's not an exact analogy? It is.

Well, that's 20 seconds of my life I will never get back.

[El Gordo]

I would like to know what our vaunted cognoscenti regard as agressive? To me it's what Detroit did in signing Benoit. They determined who the best guy was to fill a particular need and made him an offer he couldn't refuse, an offer many regard as too high. So who are the players the O's should be agressive towards? We need a SS, 1B, and a 3B at least, and I haven't seen anything like agreement as to who the best solutions are for each of these holes. Beltre? Should we have come out of the blocks with a 5/80 offer. That might have gotten him signed. Is that what will make people happy. You want Konerko? Be aggressive and offer him 4/50. That should get it done. The only FA I could see the O's being agressive towards is D.Lee. He hasn't been mentioned much in terms of teams' interest, so I imagine if you went out and offered him 2/20, you might me able to get him quick for that. As far as trades go, I haven't heard any teams mentioned in conjunction with Reynolds, perhaps we should be offering Guthrie, so we can get that done quick. That would be agressive.:rolleyestf:

[SrMeowMeow]

Well, that's 20 seconds of my life I will never get back.

I guess I can only repeat the tired old saying...it sure is good you're not our GM. You don't have the perspective for it.

[ChangeRoadUnis]

...and other than a few rumors mostly about A) guys who were in an O's uniform in 2010 (Izturis, Wigginton, & Uehara) or B) second/third-tier free agents (Hardy, Bartlett, etc.) or C) loose speculation about targets that might appease some fans (V. Martinez and Konerko)...

Where's the aggression? Where are the results? Who have the Orioles signed? I hate to be so cynical, but my expectations for this off-season are a big, fat zero. "Zero", by the way, is the impact I expect whoever the O's trick into coming to Baltimore to have.

I wrote it 10 days ago, and I stand by it: I'll believe it when I see it.

I will be absolutely STUNNED if the Orioles do anything but posture and end up signing a couple of mid or low level players like Adkins. It's just not in the cards for them to do anything.

[Sports Guy]

What did I miss? Did you and the wife get cozy again? :wedge:

Like that takes 20 seconds!

[Sports Guy]

I guess I can only repeat the tired old saying...it sure is good you're not our GM. You don't have the perspective for it.

Oh well...I guess I am just going to have to pick up the pieces of my life knowing you don't think I have the right perspective. Somehow, I think I will be able to move on despite it. It will be tough but I can get past this.

[Bradysburns]

Right. It's not like organizations and players would benefit or enjoy several weeks of down time before they have to worry about the off-season. They should push up all the winter activities so FA is wrapped-up by the first week of December. Also, every team should be forced to sign a minimum number of players and make at least one trade so their fans have something to talk about.

Then, after the holidays, MLB should put on a nightly variety show through January so that baseball fans have something else to watch and follow before pitchers and catchers report -- I mean, that's their job, right? Maybe homerun derbies one week and a highest velo contest one night for pitchers. Fielding competitions, etc.

Your not asking them to entertain -- you are asking them to be dancing monkeys for your amusement...

That sounds good - I have always wanted dancing monkeys.

[Art Wing]

I don't need to mention that this thread is a complete train wreck but this thread is a complete train wreck.

[ScottieBaseball]

No big name players have signed yet. There is a process as MacPhail would say to all of this. As soon as one big name player signs things will start moving.

So what? Why can't the Orioles move first?

Isn't there a RANT section for posts like this. What's to discuss?

There's plenty to discuss. How about how the definition of insanity is repeating the same action and expecting a different result. Maybe it is rant-ish, but there was a small part of me that was hoping the reports of "aggression" would mean an early splash.

There's been like 5 significant moves so far, if that. Overreaction, much?

They get skewered when they're in the FA speculation and hammered when they're not. Guess what, most of it's just unsubstantiated speculation.

How about we wait to see what actually happens first.

And none involving the O's. We wait every year. Most recently, we waited and wound up with guys like Garrett Atkins, Adam Eaton, Michael Gonzalez, among others. Waiting to see what happens generally involves watching free agents who could make a positive impact on this big league club sign with other teams.

What has really happened for ANY team? Uggla, Rajai, Miranda...

I mean, I know the offseason is not ever really great for the O's but few teams have done much of anything yet.

That's all I'm saying...this off-season is starting out pretty much the way we've seen them start in the past.

Its not like the guys the Os are linked to in rumors are signing contracts right and left. It takes two to tango and right now the market isn't even established. Yes I think the Orioles should set the marrket for once. But again not much is happening in the league anyhow.

How huge would it be for the Orioles to be the one to get things going this off-season?

Meanwhile there's probably message boards for 20 some odd teams with similar threads since most teams haven't done anything yet.

I bet you those 20 message boards couldn't apply the thread to last off-season, and the one before that, and the one before that, and the one before that, and the one before that, etc. and be entirely accurate.

Come on...seriously? Nothing has happened yet. I get that people are all feisty right now, but good lord. I guess MacPhail could have swooped in and overpaid for Joaquin Benoit even more than the Tigers did, or...traded for Rajai Davis or David DeJesus for our sixth and seventh outfielders or Dan Uggla for our second 2B, or...competed with the Mets to hire some more managers...

I get being tough on MacPhail. Everyone's frustrated. But why are you holding him to a higher standard than every single other GM? That's not just dumb, it's unfair.

Every single other GM's not running a franchise mired in a decade-and-a-half of losing.

Really. It's a bit odd when the editors starting dragging down the attitude on the board.

LOL...I'm sorry. Because I'm the Managing Editor here I'm not allowed to have an opinion? I'm not allowed be be frustrated? And really? My sharing it "drags down the attitude" on the board? Puh-lease.

Just so I'm clear...nothing would make me happier than to have to write a follow-up to my original blog post in which I eat crow. Seriously. If the O's bring in better players this off-season, it'll be my favorite piece ever admitting how I was wrong.

[Sports Guy]

If the Orioles had traded for Hardy, offered Beltre a contract and made significant progress with Upton, what would you be saying right now?

[SrMeowMeow]

Every single other GM's not running a franchise mired in a decade-and-a-half of losing.

Look, you just can't put those expectations on any given FO. Thirteen years of losing are not MacPhail's fault. And, in large part, the losing years under MacPhail are the product of previous regimes.

You can't expect more from the GM of a team with a long losing history. Their job is HARDER. They should be given more of the benefit of the doubt when, for example, they don't get the premium FA they wanted. Because it's harder for them.

[El Gordo]

So what? Why can't the Orioles move first?

There's plenty to discuss. How about how the definition of insanity is repeating the same action and expecting a different result. Maybe it is rant-ish, but there was a small part of me that was hoping the reports of "aggression" would mean an early splash.

And none involving the O's. We wait every year. Most recently, we waited and wound up with guys like Garrett Atkins, Adam Eaton, Michael Gonzalez, among others. Waiting to see what happens generally involves watching free agents who could make a positive impact on this big league club sign with other teams.

That's all I'm saying...this off-season is starting out pretty much the way we've seen them start in the past.

How huge would it be for the Orioles to be the one to get things going this off-season?

I bet you those 20 message boards couldn't apply the thread to last off-season, and the one before that, and the one before that, and the one before that, and the one before that, etc. and be entirely accurate.

Every single other GM's not running a franchise mired in a decade-and-a-half of losing.

LOL...I'm sorry. Because I'm the Managing Editor here I'm not allowed to have an opinion? I'm not allowed be be frustrated? And really? My sharing it "drags down the attitude" on the board? Puh-lease.

Just so I'm clear...nothing would make me happier than to have to write a follow-up to my original blog post in which I eat crow. Seriously. If the O's bring in better players this off-season, it'll be my favorite piece ever admitting how I was wrong.

Just curious, what players would you like to see the O's be aggresive towards? I would like to hear they are in serious talks about Reynolds and they have made an offer to D. Lee.