TT: The Orioles should let Duquette walk

[weams]

Regardless of where you or anyone else values Duquette, the Blue Jays certainly seem to value him very highly. It seems they continue to pursue him despite being told twice that he's not on the market. The Orioles need to get what they can. The contract length is important. Both teams seem to value his services, not to mention that the Jays are a division rival. I am fine with Duquette leaving, but you can't just let him go. The Jays need to be hurt a little in the deal.

I'm with you. I am only agreeing with Stottle that his level of compensation is what industry folks are expecting. And that is why we can all stop talking about compensation here. Because the Angelos family will never agree to that. No one is going to shame them into just letting Dan go after the gross tampering that occurred. There will be pain.

[Frobby]

You do get compensation. About the same amount you'd get for a player you value enough to pay $3 MM or so a year. Probably a little less, since players carry inherently more value than FO types and when you trade for a player you trade for the contract. Toronto is giving up compensation for the right to pay Duquette more than he is currently making.

I don't think the salaries that top baseball executives make compared to the players reflects their actual relative value. I'd much rather have a topnotch GM than a 4th OF type. The truth is, a really good GM is worth as much or more than an above average starting position player, in my opinion. They're just not paid like it.

The only reason to accept compensation that doesn't have upside equal to an above average starting position player is because (1) you don't think Duquette truly is a really good GM, and that it won't be too difficult to find someone who is likely to be just as good, or (2) you think the tension that now exists in the organization will be a problem going forward despite Duquette's abilities.

[weams]

I don't think the salaries that top baseball executives make compared to the players reflects their actual relative value. I'd much rather have a topnotch GM than a 4th OF type. The truth is, a really good GM is worth as much or more than an above average starting position player, in my opinion. They're just not paid like it.

The only reason to accept compensation that doesn't have upside equal to an above average starting position player is because (1) you don't think Duquette truly is a really good GM, and that it won't be too difficult to find someone who is likely to be just as good, or (2) you think the tension that now exists in the organization will be a problem going forward despite Duquette's abilities.

Very good post. Thanks.

[Birds08]

When was the last time we heard any kind of quote from Duquette? The silence is really becoming deafening.

[weams]

When was the last time we heard any kind of quote from Duquette? The silence is really becoming deafening.

Monday he said.

“I will talk about it when the time is appropriate."

And the time is not appropriate. No matter what you and I wish.

[Frobby]

Monday he said.

“I will talk about it when the time is appropriate."

And the time is not appropriate. No matter what you and I wish.

But it's going to come up at Fanfest, without a doubt, and it will be harder to give that kind of an answer.

[TonySoprano]

But it's going to come up at Fanfest, without a doubt, and it will be harder to give that kind of an answer.

I expect that a statement will be made before they take questions. The crowd will not like it.

[weams]

I expect that a statement will be made before they take questions. The crowd will not like it.

It's going to be a blast.

"Considering that Ken Rosenthal has been the respected National reporter constantly bringing this subject up after both clubs have been clear that they have closed positions for 2015 - what motivations would you place upon him.

And what actions would you suggest taking to prevent media from creating a toxic atmosphere here in Baltimore, much like they have in Boston and New York for decades?"

[byrdz]

I'm with you. I am only agreeing with Stottle that his level of compensation is what industry folks are expecting. And that is why we can all stop talking about compensation here. Because the Angelos family will never agree to that. No one is going to shame them into just letting Dan go after the gross tampering that occurred. There will be pain.

Unless the Jays stop trying to mark the frame an eight.

[TonySoprano]

Unless the Jays stop trying to mark the frame an eight.

Lebowski reference, I get that

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[Stotle]

Regardless of where you or anyone else values Duquette, the Blue Jays certainly seem to value him very highly. It seems they continue to pursue him despite being told twice that he's not on the market. The Orioles need to get what they can. The contract length is important. Both teams seem to value his services, not to mention that the Jays are a division rival. I am fine with Duquette leaving, but you can't just let him go. The Jays need to be hurt a little in the deal.

If the door was actually shut then this issue would have gone away a long time ago. There is a difference between "We are saying 'no, you do not and will not have our permission to speak with Duquette and we do not have any intention of letting him our of his contract.'" and "If you want us to even start down this road the conversation starts with a compensation package in line with X.'"

One is shutting the deal; one is playing hardball negotiating knowing that your worst case is bad publicity and keeping your GM.

[Stotle]

That's all fine. And in a world where our owner thinks like a baseball fan, then maybe that happens. But you do know that our owner is Potter, right? And you just think that Peter Angelos is going to play nicely, give MLB and Toronto what they want, be cooperative and do what they do in Boston or New York? After the tampering that has gone on in this process and the damage done to this organization as a result, I would not be surprised that Angelos either demands MLB take a pound of flesh out of Toronto for tampering or Potter goes outside the process and ties up Toronto and MLB in yet another lengthy lawsuit. Or he may end up yet firing Duquette and then suing him and Toronto and MLB for malfeasance and breach of contract.

Owners think like partners. Fans think owners think like solitary misers acting with little regard for anything outside of their own interests. They all need each other. They generally want to work together. They are all better off when things are running smoothly and everyone is counting money.

[tntoriole]

Owners think like partners. Fans think owners think like solitary misers acting with little regard for anything outside of their own interests. They all need each other. They generally want to work together. They are all better off when things are running smoothly and everyone is counting money.

There may be some, maybe even the majority of owners in the last twenty years, who do "think like partners." (See MASN dispute, however, as one example perhaps as to whether Potter is one of those). But I disagree that it is the "solitary miser" image that best captures them. I believe that their profile would be more that of very successful, dominating, strong willed men with considerable ego projected on to their sports holdings in a much more emotional and, at times, even irrational way than with their other businesses. And historically throughout baseball, owners have been nothing at all like collegial, let's all get along partners that you suggest. Read Lords of the Realm, a great account of the history of baseball owners.

[hoosiers]

Late to the thread, but I agree with Tony's general take about letting DD leave if it is what DD wants.

An employer should let employees go if it is for a better position.

My issue with DD leaving has more to do with who would leave with him. Would we be kissing Fred Fereira goodbye with DD? What other folks would leave as well to follow DD to Toronto? We can replace a GM, but I am not eager to replace a GM, lead international scout and several others - which was one of the biggest issues I had with hiring DD in the first place and one reason I would ask for some serious compensation.

[24fps]

Late to the thread, but I agree with Tony's general take about letting DD leave if it is what DD wants.

An employer should let employees go if it is for a better position.

My issue with DD leaving has more to do with who would leave with him. Would we be kissing Fred Fereira goodbye with DD? What other folks would leave as well to follow DD to Toronto? We can replace a GM, but I am not eager to replace a GM, lead international scout and several others - which was one of the biggest issues I had with hiring DD in the first place and one reason I would ask for some serious compensation.

It will be interesting to see if there are any restrictions as to how many staffers can follow him to Toronto without further compensation.