Bundy traded to Angels for Isaac Mattson, Kyle Bradish, Zach Peek, and Kyle Brnovich

[Roll Tide]

14 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

1) I still have not seen the quote where he said he was not tendering Villar back in September. It's not that important except you keep insisting he did and I see no such quote.  The only quote I noticed was where he said he felt no pressure to trade him which is GM speak for "I don't intend to give him away".  Unfortunately, there was never a market for Villar and he eventually got very little. 

2) You keep telling me I'm making assumptions but that is exactly what you are doing. You are assuming some team offered something decent at the deadline. My common sense tells me if that was the case, Villar would have been dealt. You prefer to assume Elias didn't know he would later non tender Villar, if it came to that.  

I don't work in the Warehouse and neither do you. The difference is you have all of these theories regarding the budget discussed in September and that's when Elias first realized he was under pressure to deal Villar.  I am using common sense. Try it.

1) Then you haven’t gone to the Villar trade thread and looked through the last few pages. Do so, I assure you it’s there!

Add “because no one else is a pending free agent” to your partial quote.

“trade him which is GM speak for "I don't intend to give him away".  Unfortunately, there was never a market for Villar and he eventually got very little. “

This quote is just your opinion base on no material fact. 
 

I have no idea what he was offered at the deadline. We can agree on that. He obviously didn’t like what he was offered enough to deal. 
 

Was it more than he settled for Monday. We don’t know and probably never will! My common sense tells me he probably was offered more. Your says he wasn’t.  We agree to disagree.

I’m saying I don’t know when the budget for 2020 was discussed. I am just using Elias’ quotes to work through the timeline. 
 

All you have is smart ass comments about your common sense. And I should try using some! 
 

Buzz Off!

[Roll Tide]

13 minutes ago, Frobby said:

But a repeatedly published one.   So, regardless of what Elias might have said previously, that rumor (which presumably didn’t come from Elias) certainly told all 30 GM’s that if they had a bid to make on Villar, they should do it.     

I really didn’t think the earlier interview stuff you quoted at length the other day made it clear Villar would be non-tendered.     If it had, the OH would have been obsessing about it back then.    But crickets.   
 

Noted ... Thanks

[weams]

41 minutes ago, wildbillhiccup said:

I get it Weams, but he really needs a time out. This has escalated from his frustration over the team releasing Villar to him pushing a ridiculously false narrative about Elias basically being an idiot. It's the very definition of irresponsible posting. 

No one is getting a time out but the subject is war torn at this point. I'd recommend cooling the whole back and forth at this point. 

[Frobby]

4 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

I have said it's possible Elias was offered a bit more at the deadline. Anything of real substance and Villar would have been moved.  

Elias did say this the other day — pardon me if this quote already appears in this thread:

“Certainly, we’re pleased with where it landed. We had listened on him in the past, last trade deadline, but nothing came our way and we were the beneficiaries of a huge second half that he had last year and he really had a great August and kept our team rolling down the stretch. We’re going to miss him, but this was the right move for us on a number of levels.”   https://www.masnsports.com/school-of-roch/2019/12/elias-on-trade-tenders-and-more.html

That certainly doesn’t sound as if he got a better offer (or any offer, really) previously.    Of course, he could be spinning, but I tend to believe what Elias says unless given a reason to think otherwise.

[7Mo]

1 minute ago, Frobby said:

Elias did say this the other day — pardon me if this quote already appears in this thread:

“Certainly, we’re pleased with where it landed. We had listened on him in the past, last trade deadline, but nothing came our way and we were the beneficiaries of a huge second half that he had last year and he really had a great August and kept our team rolling down the stretch. We’re going to miss him, but this was the right move for us on a number of levels.”   https://www.masnsports.com/school-of-roch/2019/12/elias-on-trade-tenders-and-more.html

That certainly doesn’t sound as if he got a better offer (or any offer, really) previously.    Of course, he could be spinning, but I tend to believe what Elias says unless given a reason to think otherwise.

From what we've seen so far, Elias appears to be very transparent with his quotes. 

[Tony-OH]

2 hours ago, atomic said:

We should move our triple A team to Rockville. 

Riiiiiight, because everyone loves hitting the 495 beltway or maneuvering through Montgomery county between 5 and 7 during the week.

[Tony-OH]

56 minutes ago, thezeroes said:

This is a Bundy thread, I do not think we need to re-hash the 69 pages that were already used for that purpose of the Villar Non-tender, cut , release , trade, whatever.

This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Please do not let other thread discussions seep into other ones. 

Besides, I think it's very clear what everyone thinks about the Villar trade, no one is going to change their minds at this point.

Once the Villar trade happened, it made sense to trade Bundy and the return brought in a quantity of arms that have some potential, particularly with Peek if all the reports are right. 

Givens is probably next and Mancini won't be far behind though "Far behind could be next year offseason."

[Tony-OH]

12 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Now Rolltide can go back to how Elias bungled it by publicly announcing, in September, that he would non tender Villar in December. Unfortunately, that quote only appears in his imagination to which no one else has access.  Bzzzzzz.

Don't troll. This brings nothing to the board. You've made this point so making a whole other post just to say this again is literally the definition of trolling which is not allowed on our site.

[SteveA]

Bundy made a transition last year.   He accepted the fact that he had permanently lost velocity on his fastball and would have to learn to rely on his offspeed pitches more, and he made that adjustment.   It was nice to watch.   He no longer will over be overpowering.   The pitcher I saw last year could gut his way through an effective 6 innings if he hit his spots, and could be pretty bad if he didn't.   The result was a reduction of HRs allowed from 41 to 29.   In fact, his HR rate, his ERA, his WHIP, and his hit rate all improved as he made this adjustment.   His walks went up a bit and his strikeouts went down a bit, though.

I guess the big quesiton is will he be able to sustain what he did last year and be that kind of pitcher, relying on location and guile more than an overpowering out pitch, moving forward.   If he is he could last a long time in the majors.   Maybe in two years we'll be ready to contend and need a savvy veteran to be a back end starter in our rotation full of young studs and he will be available as a free agent.

[atomic]

2 hours ago, Tony-OH said:

Riiiiiight, because everyone loves hitting the 495 beltway or maneuvering through Montgomery county between 5 and 7 during the week.

Not an REM fan I guess.  But just think if our triple A Team was in Rockville we could tell Mountcastle: “Don’t go back to Rockville ... and waste another year.”

[sportsfan8703]

15 hours ago, 7Mo said:

Eppler said almost exactly what you're saying here.

“Quite frankly, you give up players you just recently drafted, that can go in a number of directions.”

From an O’s fan point of view, I really like this quote. 

That’s the Angels GM telling us right there that this type of deal is a little risky for the trading club. 

Let’s say they would have given us their #4 prospect in AA with a 50 value. Well that player is so heavily scouted, and there’s such a book on him, that team’s pretty much know what they’re giving up. By getting these recent draftees, we’re getting guys that have a little bit of an unknown ceiling because there are question marks. 

I like Elias’ strategy. It shows me that they must have really dug into the 2019 draft to know this much about a lot of players. What else did they have to do?  Also, I like that he’s trusting his “system” and targeting guys that fit that system. 

Plans fail, like others have said, but at least we know Elias has one. 

[Roll Tide]

On 12/4/2019 at 4:18 PM, Enjoy Terror said:

That seals the deal. I am no longer an Orioles fan. I’ve been a fan since 1982 and a season ticket holder since 1996. I officially will not be renewing my plan next season nor will I watch on tv ever again. Elias is officially the worst gm in history.

Obviously you are joking here. But I'd be willing to bet that likelihood of any fan taking that stance over Bundy is low. But even lower for a person that posts or even frequents a site like this.

A rare occurrence does happen. I remember @JTrea81 talking of walking away over Angelos and something that was going on.

I believe he blew a gasket and may have even been banned for a while. 

[Frobby]

Elias on the trade process:

“It was vastly different for a while, and then we kind of boiled it down to the two or three teams at the end that were the most serious and really treating him with the type of evaluation that we feel he deserved,” Elias said.

“There were similar offers from a couple other clubs. We just liked these guys better, the Angels’ names better.”

https://www.masnsports.com/school-of-roch/2019/12/solid-statuses-for-wynns-and-wojciechowski-heading-into-spring.html

Seems like Elias had a good process here.

 

[Roll Tide]

9 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Elias on the trade process:

“It was vastly different for a while, and then we kind of boiled it down to the two or three teams at the end that were the most serious and really treating him with the type of evaluation that we feel he deserved,” Elias said.

“There were similar offers from a couple other clubs. We just liked these guys better, the Angels’ names better.”

https://www.masnsports.com/school-of-roch/2019/12/solid-statuses-for-wynns-and-wojciechowski-heading-into-spring.html

Seems like Elias had a good process here.

 

I heard the clips on the radio this morning. I’m fine with the process and it seems like the deal progressed fairly quick.

I would have been interested in the question of why quantity over quality. Obviously they didn’t play the whole show so maybe it was asked. 
 

I don’t mind the deal as much as some here. But I would have preferred a player less with a more prestigious main player.

But it’s mainly stating a preference for conversation as I really think it was a decent trade.

[Moose Milligan]

48 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

I heard the clips on the radio this morning. I’m fine with the process and it seems like the deal progressed fairly quick.

I would have been interested in the question of why quantity over quality. Obviously they didn’t play the whole show so maybe it was asked. 
 

I don’t mind the deal as much as some here. But I would have preferred a player less with a more prestigious main player.

But it’s mainly stating a preference for conversation as I really think it was a decent trade.

This all assumes that quality was a choice.

I think the notion that GM's get to pick more players over a smaller amount of better ones in trades is the stuff of baseball fan message board fantasy land.