Orioles Agree to Deal With Severino

[Sports Guy]

7 minutes ago, NCRaven said:

A good thing about Mancini is that, IIRC, he hits well as a DH.  So, if he does need to be eased into action, which would not surprise me, he can be productive at DH.  As noted by others, many players just don't hit as well at DH.

And this is the other thing no one wants to talk about.  Maybe DHing these young kids is a bad way to develop them.  People are like, just DH Hays and Mountcastle, etc...well maybe that doesn’t work well for you them.

Frobby pointed this out before but DHing isn’t for everyone and when you have a guy who does well at it, there’s nothing wrong with keeping that guy around, especially if they are really cheap.

I, for one, don’t have much interest in seeing most of those guys getting any kind of regular at bats at DH.  Stewart is the exception to that.

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

14 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

And this is the other thing no one wants to talk about.  Maybe DHing these young kids is a bad way to develop them.  People are like, just DH Hays and Mountcastle, etc...well maybe that doesn’t work well for you them.

Frobby pointed this out before but DHing isn’t for everyone and when you have a guy who does well at it, there’s nothing wrong with keeping that guy around, especially if they are really cheap.

I, for one, don’t have much interest in seeing most of those guys getting any kind of regular at bats at DH.  Stewart is the exception to that.

Even with players you prefer to use ay DH it doesn't always work. Mark Trumbo in his career put up a .862 OPS playing RF, .764 at 1B and only .695 at DH and Trumbo was a player suited ideally to be a DH.

 

[Legend_Of_Joey]

34 minutes ago, NCRaven said:

A good thing about Mancini is that, IIRC, he hits well as a DH.  So, if he does need to be eased into action, which would not surprise me, he can be productive at DH.  As noted by others, many players just don't hit as well at DH.

Yep.

In 58 games as DH, he has his highest average (.290) and 15 home runs. While in the field, he had many more games (87, 149, 182) with  lower average and only slight more home runs (20, 26, and 24).

[LookinUp]

17 hours ago, owknows said:

I would guess that Pedro saw the lion's share of the young, jumpy, control issue pitchers.

I think it's a little rich to blame Severino's defense last year on the pitching. He really was lazy at times.

I also think that maybe he just had a down year. Sometimes you get into bad habits. My recollection was that he had a positive defensive reputation when we brought him in originally. Hopefully he can re-focus on pitch blocking so he can prevent wild pitches and not allow passed balls. I assume the O's are hoping as much too.

With that said, I think the problem with criticism of this move is the assumption that we could get as good, or nearly as good, on the cheap (which this deal is). I'm not convinced that the total value of an available minimum salary catcher would be  comparable. I don't love Severino, but I suspect he'd be orders of magnitude better than a guy like Wynns or Sisco over a large sample size.

[Frobby]

5 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

I don’t think the backup NEEDS to be anything.  Why does the backup have to be outstanding on defense?  Is that in the rule books or something?

I completely reject the notion that defense is all you need at any particular position, such as SS or C.    At every position, the analysis is the same: does this guy add more runs with his bat than he subtracts with his glove (or vice versa).    Derek Jeter is widely regarded a poor defensive SS but he was an excellent hitter and his teams were way better off having him than not.    Ditto Mike Piazza at C.     Those are extreme examples but there are dozens if not hundreds of other examples.    Some fans are offended by players or teams that are good with the bat but below average with the glove, but I say, whatever works.   The Dodgers were a -15.3 defensive team this year, per Fangraphs.   23rd of 30 teams.   Think their fans care?

[Can_of_corn]

8 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I completely reject the notion that defense is all you need at any particular position, such as SS or C.    At every position, the analysis is the same: does this guy add more runs with his bat than he subtracts with his glove (or vice versa).    Derek Jeter is widely regarded a poor defensive SS but he was an excellent hitter and his teams were way better off having him than not.    Ditto Mike Piazza at C.     Those are extreme examples but there are dozens if not hundreds of other examples.    Some fans are offended by players or teams that are good with the bat but below average with the glove, but I say, whatever works.   The Dodgers were a -15.3 defensive team this year, per Fangraphs.   23rd of 30 teams.   Think their fans care?

I'm picturing one disgruntled Dodger fan on a Dodger message board complaining about how his joy in a WS is tainted by the team's poor defense.

[DrungoHazewood]

14 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I completely reject the notion that defense is all you need at any particular position, such as SS or C.    At every position, the analysis is the same: does this guy add more runs with his bat than he subtracts with his glove (or vice versa).    Derek Jeter is widely regarded a poor defensive SS but he was an excellent hitter and his teams were way better off having him than not.    Ditto Mike Piazza at C.     Those are extreme examples but there are dozens if not hundreds of other examples.    Some fans are offended by players or teams that are good with the bat but below average with the glove, but I say, whatever works.   The Dodgers were a -15.3 defensive team this year, per Fangraphs.   23rd of 30 teams.   Think their fans care?

Cue @Old#5fan defending Luis Hernandez and the all-glove model of shortstop.

[Sports Guy]

20 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I completely reject the notion that defense is all you need at any particular position, such as SS or C.    At every position, the analysis is the same: does this guy add more runs with his bat than he subtracts with his glove (or vice versa).    Derek Jeter is widely regarded a poor defensive SS but he was an excellent hitter and his teams were way better off having him than not.    Ditto Mike Piazza at C.     Those are extreme examples but there are dozens if not hundreds of other examples.    Some fans are offended by players or teams that are good with the bat but below average with the glove, but I say, whatever works.   The Dodgers were a -15.3 defensive team this year, per Fangraphs.   23rd of 30 teams.   Think their fans care?

Yea it’s annoying.  It’s like saying the lead off hitter has to be fast.

No they don’t. 

[BohKnowsBmore]

8 hours ago, LookinUp said:

I think it's a little rich to blame Severino's defense last year on the pitching. He really was lazy at times.

I also think that maybe he just had a down year. Sometimes you get into bad habits. My recollection was that he had a positive defensive reputation when we brought him in originally. Hopefully he can re-focus on pitch blocking so he can prevent wild pitches and not allow passed balls. I assume the O's are hoping as much too.

With that said, I think the problem with criticism of this move is the assumption that we could get as good, or nearly as good, on the cheap (which this deal is). I'm not convinced that the total value of an available minimum salary catcher would be  comparable. I don't love Severino, but I suspect he'd be orders of magnitude better than a guy like Wynns or Sisco over a large sample size.

Out of curiosity, why have you written off Sisco?

[linedrive]

I'm guessing Elias thinks he'll be able to make a trade at some point. I think this will turn out to be a good move in the long run.

[BohKnowsBmore]

1 hour ago, linedrive said:

I'm guessing Elias thinks he'll be able to make a trade at some point. I think this will turn out to be a good move in the long run.

Agreed. Catcher is a position a lot of potential contenders look to bolster at the deadline, particularly because you typically need two of them. 

[TommyPickles]

I like the resigning of Severino.  Plus it can't hurt to have a little more offensive production from the catcher spot, considering the bats of the people we'll be running out to play middle infield next year...

[Frobby]

11 hours ago, BohKnowsBmore said:

Agreed. Catcher is a position a lot of potential contenders look to bolster at the deadline, particularly because you typically need two of them. 

We may be able to trade him, but unless he has an atypically strong year, I wouldn’t expect much in return.   Less than we just got for Iglesias, for example.  JMO.

[Sports Guy]

14 minutes ago, Frobby said:

We may be able to trade him, but unless he has an atypically strong year, I wouldn’t expect much in return.   Less than we just got for Iglesias, for example.  JMO.

I would happily trade Severino for  either 1 of the players we got for Iglesias.

[LookinUp]

38 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Didn't Iglesias just have an atypical strong year (with the bat)?.   Just saying.   Severino is 27, I believe, and he had a strong start last year.   He's capable of putting up a good 2-3 months.   

Going by memory, but he seems to be streaky. Might be the type of guy to get hot at just the right time for a trade.