Update: Orioles sign 17 international players highlighted by Basallo and Hernandez

[Can_of_corn]

9 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

So the two teams you mention make the offer mention. The Orioles enter the scene and offer said player 3.5 million. So the player says no because he has a relationship with those 2? I highly doubt it.

Also ...as I mentioned if you are right about 30 kids being pretty comparable why overpay 2.5 million if they can get 5 comparable guys for that same money.

 

These 16 year olds don't need an extra million.

[Sports Guy]

10 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

So the two teams you mention make the offer mention. The Orioles enter the scene and offer said player 3.5 million. So the player says no because he has a relationship with those 2? I highly doubt it.

Also ...as I mentioned if you are right about 30 kids being pretty comparable why overpay 2.5 million if they can get 5 comparable guys for that same money.

 

Maybe the Os could offer 1M more but why would they?  Because Ben Badler ranks that player higher?

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Sports Guy said:

Maybe the Os could offer 1M more but why would they?  Because Ben Badler ranks that player higher?

I've never heard of a team intentionally overpaying for a player before.

 

[Frobby]

32 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

No this is wrong.  
 

The Yankees aren’t the only team courting that player.  But they are the team that is willing to pay them the most and has built that relationship.  The player may have the same relationship with the Tigers but Detroit only views them as a 1.5M investment and NY views them at 2.5M.

I think it’s important to reiterate here (for the benefit of other readers, not necessarily you) that the system has changed pretty drastically in recent years, going from no cap to a soft cap to a hard cap where certain teams get more slots than others.    It used to be that the Yankees (and other rich teams) could simply outbid other teams for international players.   Now they have to choose how to allocate their spending pool.    It’s a very different ballgame.  

That said, the Yankees did pay a $5 mm bonus to Jasson Dominguez in 2019, spending 90% of their allotment on one player.   

[Sports Guy]

1 minute ago, Frobby said:

I think it’s important to reiterate here (for the benefit of other readers, not necessarily you) that the system has changed pretty drastically in recent years, going from no cap to a soft cap to a hard cap where certain teams get more slots than others.    It used to be that the Yankees (and other rich teams) could simply outbid other teams for international players.   Now they have to choose how to allocate their spending pool.    It’s a very different ballgame.  

That said, the Yankees did pay a $5 mm bonus to Jasson Dominguez in 2019, spending 90% of their allotment on one player.   

Sure and if you think that player is that special, as they obviously do, do that.  I would rather have 1 elite guy than 25 lottery tickets.

That being said, it’s hard to judge a guy elite at age 16.

[Roll Tide]

21 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

These 16 year olds don't need an extra million.

Then why are the teams giving the top rated guys an extra million? 

[Roll Tide]

19 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I've never heard of a team intentionally overpaying for a player before.

 

Can you go back and read the thread please? Jesus ....talk about jumping in the middle. The Orioles allegedly have deals with the 30ish and 35th best guy. I called that dredging the bottom of the bin.

SG says these kids are basically all lottery tickets .... Why the. Would the Dodgers or Yankees get the top guys and give the. More money? Why would they not send that 2.5 million and spend it on multiple guys if they are all the same.

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

Then why are the teams giving the top rated guys an extra million? 

That was sarcasm, I'm on your side of this one.

What I think is actually going on is that teams are colluding against these young players to keep bonuses down.  They basically call "dibs" a couple years in advance.  They don't want a team coming in and starting a bidding war, even with the cap to spending.

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Roll Tide said:

Can you go back and read the thread please? Jesus ....talk about jumping in the middle. The Orioles allegedly have deals with the 30ish and 35th best guy. I called that dredging the bottom of the bin.

SG says these kids are basically all lottery tickets .... Why the. Would the Dodgers or Yankees get the top guys and give the. More money? Why would they not send that 2.5 million and spend it on multiple guys if they are all the same.

I've read the thread.

You appear to have difficulty discerning the intent of my posts.

Obviously teams have overpaid for players in the past.  For instance Boston had to pay Price a premium to get to come to Boston, and NY had to pay Sabathis a premium to get him to pitch in the AL.

[Jammer7]

5 hours ago, Roll Tide said:

So there are 32 teams and the best talent you can talk into signing or willing to pay enough to sign with you is the 30-35 best available player.

Imagine the MLB draft every year if the Orioles were forced to pick somewhere in the 30-35 range. Would you sign up for that? 

32 teams? Did I miss something?

Yes, if it is a major improvement over what has been the status quo for decades. Drafting 30th would be a dramatic improvement if you had been drafting around 200th for 20 years, no? I get your point, certainly valid. But to build this program from the ground up in two years...it is impressive to me. You cannot just go there and throw around money. It takes time to build relationships and trust with the buscones/handlers/trainers and the families of the kids. They had to hire essentially a complete new scouting staff and revamp the infrastructure completely. 

Read up on Hernandez and Basallo. Not much video out there. 

[Roll Tide]

11 minutes ago, Jammer7 said:

32 teams? Did I miss something?

Yes, if it is a major improvement over what has been the status quo for decades. Drafting 30th would be a dramatic improvement if you had been drafting around 200th for 20 years, no? I get your point, certainly valid. But to build this program from the ground up in two years...it is impressive to me. You cannot just go there and throw around money. It takes time to build relationships and trust with the buscones/handlers/trainers and the families of the kids. They had to hire essentially a complete new scouting staff and revamp the infrastructure completely. 

Read up on Hernandez and Basallo. Not much video out there. 

It’s already been pointed out. I’m a moron, have no credibility, and am clueless. 
 

 

[Roll Tide]

34 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

That was sarcasm, I'm on your side of this one.

What I think is actually going on is that teams are colluding against these young players to keep bonuses down.  They basically call "dibs" a couple years in advance.  They don't want a team coming in and starting a bidding war, even with the cap to spending.

My mistake.... are they signing the 30ish type guys because they are late to the party or avoiding the guys that that haves focus on due to money.

Rob believes that these guys are essentially all the same. I don’t and it’s obvious the teams that overspend on the high rated guys don’t. 

[Can_of_corn]

8 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

My mistake.... are they signing the 30ish type guys because they are late to the party or avoiding the guys that that haves focus on due to money.

Rob believes that these guys are essentially all the same. I don’t and it’s obvious the teams that overspend on the high rated guys don’t. 

I think they while highly regarded guys can flop, and under the radar guys can flourish, guys that are more highly regarded are so for a reason.  They don't just pick 30 names at random to put on a list.

[Philip]

1 hour ago, Roll Tide said:

Can you go back and read the thread please? Jesus ....talk about jumping in the middle. The Orioles allegedly have deals with the 30ish and 35th best guy. I called that dredging the bottom of the bin.

SG says these kids are basically all lottery tickets .... Why the. Would the Dodgers or Yankees get the top guys and give the. More money? Why would they not send that 2.5 million and spend it on multiple guys if they are all the same.

Maybe the reference is to the remaining guys as being essentially all the same? The real stars sign quickly and long ago, and what is left behind are the normal guys.

i’m kind of interested in what is the maximum number of guys a given system can have, and if you sign a guy when he’s 16 or 17, where in the world are his parents, are they really gonna let him go from the DR to the United States for five years?

Finally, at what point does a team give up on a guy?

Sign him at 16, and then what?

If he’s not an AA at 21 you dump him?  Every boy at 16 is nothing but potential, how long do they give to realize it?

[Philip]

My previous question was just an aside my real Comment is that at the moment, I think casting a very wide net is best, and I hope we’re not just in Latin America. I wonder if we have any scouts in Scandinavia? Or in Germany, or wherever they’re big strong guys who can throw 90 miles an hour?