Why did Elias DFA Tom Eshelman? Jones promotion and the OF traffic jam.

[Philip]

Let me stress that I don’t have any problem with calling him up, especially if we can replace one of the three or four worse guys. But the report is that his defense at second is all but unusable, so I would rather he come up and replace Stewart, let Martin come up and take over short next week when he’s ready, move Urias to 2nd, bearing in mind that Urias Has done well overall and could possibly be a usable part of our next 500 team, and dump Valaika or Leyba.

so:

Martin to SS, Urias to 2B, Jones to DH/LF, Stewart to AAA Leyba DFA.

 

[bpilktree]

I don’t understand why people get so upset with this team because they try to play a guy that isn’t his best position.  They act like only the Orioles do it as well with square peg round hold arguement.  Aaron Judge is not a center fielder, Yordan Alvarez is not anything resembling an outfielder, Kyle Schwarber was not a catcher or even an outfielder, Schoop was not a SS.  Yet all these teams were or are playoff teams that was just trying to find a place and way to get a bat in the lineup.  You can name tons more guys that fit this bill all throughout the majors.  You have even more in the minors with guys trying new positions throughout them. 

[7Mo]

13 minutes ago, bpilktree said:

Kyle Schwarber was not a catcher or even an outfielder, Schoop was not a SS.  Yet all these teams were or are playoff teams that was just trying to find a place and way to get a bat in the lineup.  You can name tons more guys that fit this bill all throughout the majors.  You have even more in the minors with guys trying new positions throughout them. 

Good post and rather than trade for a first baseman, the Red Sox are about to play the non-first baseman Schwarber at first base. 

[Explosivo]

4 hours ago, Philip said:

Why is every heart set on Jones at 2B when he’s got such bad defense that even Elias had to defend him? 
the purpose of the minors is for a guy to show his parameters. Often a guy is worse when he is promoted, but he’s rarely better. Why set him up to be a disaster at 2B? If he’s LF-bound, option Stewart and let Jones stumble around LF for a while.

Why DFA Eshelman instead of Anderson?

Because necessity is the mother of invention. Because people can learn and improve. He has played this position before. This is not completely new.

Edited August 2, 2021 by Explosivo

[Philip]

7 minutes ago, Explosivo said:

Because necessity is the mother of invention. Because people can learn and improve. He has played this position before. This is not completely new.

I knew nothing about the guy before we got him, but since we’ve gotten him, all the talk has been about how he can hit but his defense is bad.

Since I have been following this team, the attitude towards Defense has been completely cavalier, to the extent that when someone in the organization actually admits that a guys defense is bad, that really says something.
I have no Desire to be a martyr to this particular cause, so if they want to bring him up and let him play second, fine I don’t care. But his defense is bad, it has been bad, and defense doesn’t change as one goes through levels. The inability to throw or catch or footwork is the same whether at single A or AAA.

So it makes more sense to put him in a position where he is more likely to succeed.

Edited August 2, 2021 by Philip

[Bob]

To say Eshelman is "a dime a dozen" is not only cruel its ridiculous. Have a little more class than that. This kid has worked his whole life to get to the major's. Have any of you gotten that far? 

[Explosivo]

2 minutes ago, Philip said:

I knew nothing about the guy before we got him, but since we’ve gotten him, all the talk has been about how he can hit but his defense is bad.

Since I have been following this team, the attitude towards Defense has been completely cavalier, to the extent that when someone in the organization actually admits that a guys defense is bad, that really says something.
I have no Desire to be a martyr to this particular cause, so if they want to bring him up and let him play second, fine I don’t care. But his defense is bad, it has been bad, and defense doesn’t change as one goes through levels. The inability to throw or catch or footwork is the same whether at single A or AAA.

So it makes more sense to put him in a position where he is more likely to succeed.

That’s not true at all man. But his place on this team and in baseball is at second. Sometimes players have delusions of grandeur like Bannon and fancy themselves in a position that will never happen. I’m glad Jones is willing to become a second baseman. We saw recently with Ruiz that defense can improve. He is extremely athletic for a second baseman as well. He will have two years to improve, pitfalls and all. 
 

That being said, don’t for a second think that fans of winning baseball are cavalier about defense. Three keys to winning baseball: pitching (which is coming), defense up the middle (which is developing) and timely hitting.

[Aristotelian]

8 minutes ago, Explosivo said:

That’s not true at all man. But his place on this team and in baseball is at second. Sometimes players have delusions of grandeur like Bannon and fancy themselves in a position that will never happen. I’m glad Jones is willing to become a second baseman. We saw recently with Ruiz that defense can improve. He is extremely athletic for a second baseman as well. He will have two years to improve, pitfalls and all. 

Which Ruiz are we talking about here? 

[Explosivo]

Probably not the best example but Rio’s defense from 2019 to 2020 at third was a remarkable uptick. Regardless, I’m sure there are other more palatable examples for you sullen Oriole faithful.

[Gentile4]

1 hour ago, Philip said:

I knew nothing about the guy before we got him, but since we’ve gotten him, all the talk has been about how he can hit but his defense is bad.

You mean message board talk? I'm not here defend Jones, but I have to believe that if his infield defense is as atrocious as many imply, the Orioles brass, who watch him every day, wouldn't even waste the time at AAA playing him at 2B.

[interloper]

Like others my gut reaction was to DFA Anderson over Eshelman, just because Eshelman has at least proven to eat innings despite the poor ERA. Anderson I'm not sure what the fascination is, but I guess he's younger and throws harder and has ok minor league numbers, kinda. Also he does have starting experience, which I didn't realize, and that makes him a decent depth piece for next year, maybe. 

Ultimately, Eshelman will probably clear because he's cleared like two other times. And I agree this is about Richie Martin needing a 40-man spot. 

[SteveA]

15 minutes ago, interloper said:

Like others my gut reaction was to DFA Anderson over Eshelman, just because Eshelman has at least proven to eat innings despite the poor ERA. Anderson I'm not sure what the fascination is, but I guess he's younger and throws harder and has ok minor league numbers, kinda. Also he does have starting experience, which I didn't realize, and that makes him a decent depth piece for next year, maybe. 

Ultimately, Eshelman will probably clear because he's cleared like two other times. And I agree this is about Richie Martin needing a 40-man spot. 

Do we still have to clear a 40 man spot for that guy we picked up on waivers from Houston or has that been done?   If so, what was the move.

The 40 man moves I know of in the past 4 or 5 days are Akin and Santander coming off the Covid list, Galvis being traded, and Eshelman being DFA'd.   So I think we gotta find a spot to add that pitcher we picked up.

[Redskins Rick]

The amount of time on this one dude, is crazy, seriously.

Why do we get so worked up over the small crap that doesnt amount to a hill of beans?

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

27 minutes ago, interloper said:

Like others my gut reaction was to DFA Anderson over Eshelman, just because Eshelman has at least proven to eat innings despite the poor ERA. Anderson I'm not sure what the fascination is, but I guess he's younger and throws harder and has ok minor league numbers, kinda. Also he does have starting experience, which I didn't realize, and that makes him a decent depth piece for next year, maybe. 

Ultimately, Eshelman will probably clear because he's cleared like two other times. And I agree this is about Richie Martin needing a 40-man spot. 

Anderson's day for the waiver wire is coming sooner or later. 

[Explosivo]

15 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

The amount of time on this one dude, is crazy, seriously.

Why do we get so worked up over the small crap that doesnt amount to a hill of beans?

Because these fellas think they figured it out and they don’t like seeing what is happening ruffle what they thought should happen. Jones is a great athlete, great kid and his bat and speed gives 2b a differentiated product from other teams if it works out. Again, we have plenty of time to give him to figure it out and when we are good in two years that time spent will hopefully be worth the short term pain. 
 

On the plus side as well, it will make these sullen Oriole faithful squirm and you love to see that any day of the week.

Edited August 2, 2021 by Explosivo