Kelvin Gutierrez’s defense

[sportsfan8703]

1 hour ago, interloper said:

Harrison on a 1 year deal, maybe with an option, would definitely be alright with me. He at least gets on base a little. 

But in this market it’s looking like Harrison will get 2/16. I want to see what Guiterrez can do. Late bloomer?  Finally getting everyday ABs?  I’m willing to ride 2022 out with Guiterrez and Odor at 3B, with Westburg and Gunnar in AAA. 
 

Why spend money on Harrison, when we have no viable rotation? Harrison would be a good signing if we needed a 2 year stop gap and had the SP to compete. We just don’t have that SP. So take a chance on Guiterrez putting things together, or Odor rebounding. Then we get into can Nevin play 3B. Bannon?  
 

Put it like this, with our roster construction, we’re not losing 100 games next year because of our 3B. It’s the SP. 

[wildcard]

47 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

But in this market it’s looking like Harrison will get 2/16. I want to see what Guiterrez can do. Late bloomer?  Finally getting everyday ABs?  I’m willing to ride 2022 out with Guiterrez and Odor at 3B, with Westburg and Gunnar in AAA. 
 

Why spend money on Harrison, when we have no viable rotation? Harrison would be a good signing if we needed a 2 year stop gap and had the SP to compete. We just don’t have that SP. So take a chance on Guiterrez putting things together, or Odor rebounding. Then we get into can Nevin play 3B. Bannon?  
 

Put it like this, with our roster construction, we’re not losing 100 games next year because of our 3B. It’s the SP. 

Link please.  Where are you getting that the market for Harrison is 2/16?   MLBTR does not have him in the top 50 FAs.

[sportsfan8703]

1 minute ago, wildcard said:

Link please.  Where are you getting that the market for Harrison is 2/16?   MLBTR does not have him in the top 50 FAs.

So you want me to link an article to MLBTR who has been wayyyy off on all their projections. Who does that help?  

[wildcard]

4 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

So you want me to link an article to MLBTR who has been wayyyy off on all their projections. Who does that help?  

If you can find a MLBTR article that says he is projected to get 2/16m please do.  I would like to see it.  I would like to see any source that is saying Harrison is projected  to get 2/16.

[Frobby]

38 minutes ago, wildcard said:

If you can find a MLBTR article that says he is projected to get 2/16m please do.  I would like to see it.  I would like to see any source that is saying Harrison is projected  to get 2/16.

There won’t be one.  He hasn’t made more than $2 mm in a season since he became a free agent in 2019.  He’s 34 years old.   He might be worth more than he’s been paid recently, but nobody’s coughing up anything in the same solar system as 2/$16 mm.

[wildcard]

1 minute ago, Frobby said:

There won’t be one.  He hasn’t made more than $2 mm in a season since he became a free agent in 2019.  He’s 34 years old.   He might be worth more than he’s been paid recently, but nobody’s coughing up anything in the same solar system as 2/$16 mm.

The OH will not allow misinformation without being challenged.

[InsideCoroner]

I would give Gutierrez the chance lose the job. Worth 0.8 bWAR in 47 games and he was enjoyable to watch in the field (especially after having to watch 100 games of Maikel Franco). His bat wouldn’t fly at third base in a postseason run, but ‘22 is not that year. 

[sportsfan8703]

19 hours ago, wildcard said:

The OH will not allow misinformation without being challenged.

It’s all conjecture until he signs. 

[wildcard]

12 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

It’s all conjecture until he signs. 

Yep....... but 2/16 is very unlikely.   I'd say 1/2m.

[sportsfan8703]

2 hours ago, wildcard said:

Yep....... but 2/16 is very unlikely.   I'd say 1/2m.

Well opinions drive conversations here. If you’re closer I will respectfully tip my cap to you. 
 

The league min for a vet is like 800k. So you think he’s only going to get 1.2 over the league min?  If he’s getting that we should be all over him like a fly on stank. 
 

I like Harrison’s game, and I really like the idea of signing a stop gap with upside for 2 years rather than one. My 2/16 prediction was as at the height of the crazy market signing frenzy. Idk what’s going to happen with the CBA. I don’t know what teams are going to be in on him. Heck, he might decide to sign with a Korean or Japanese team. 

Edited December 11, 2021 by sportsfan8703

[Frobby]

36 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Well opinions drive conversations here. If you’re closer I will respectfully tip my cap to you. 
 

The league min for a vet is like 800k. So you think he’s only going to get 1.2 over the league min?  If he’s getting that we should be all over him like a fly on stank. 
 

I like Harrison’s game, and I really like the idea of signing a stop gap with upside for 2 years rather than one. My 2/16 prediction was as at the height of the crazy market signing frenzy. Idk what’s going to happen with the CBA. I don’t know what teams are going to be in on him. Heck, he might decide to sign with a Korean or Japanese team. 

While I don't think Harrison will get anything like 2/$16 mm, it's interesting to note that Eduardo Escobar recently got 2/$20 mm from the Mets.

Escobar (33 next year) -- .256/.309/.436, 99 OPS+, 12.1 rWAR career; .253/.314/.472, 109 OPS+, 2.4 rWAR in 2021

Harrison (34 next year) -- .274/.318/.401, 96 OPS+, 16.2 rWAR career; .279/.341/.400, 106 OPS+, 2.1 rWAR in 2021

Harrison's problem is that he was awful in 2018-19, and missed a lot of time in 2020.

[LA2]

Harrison has had a very inconsistent career. I'm not going to bet a large amount of money on him having up seasons at the ages of 35-36. Franco was a better bet after his good 108 OPS+ 2020 season with the Royals, five years younger, and cost under a million bucks--and look how that turned out. Harrison has a better glove than Franco, but we have Gutierrez for that.

[Frobby]

On 12/10/2021 at 4:51 PM, sportsfan8703 said:

But in this market it’s looking like Harrison will get 2/16. I want to see what Guiterrez can do. Late bloomer?  Finally getting everyday ABs?  I’m willing to ride 2022 out with Guiterrez and Odor at 3B, with Westburg and Gunnar in AAA. 
 

Why spend money on Harrison, when we have no viable rotation? Harrison would be a good signing if we needed a 2 year stop gap and had the SP to compete. We just don’t have that SP. So take a chance on Guiterrez putting things together, or Odor rebounding. Then we get into can Nevin play 3B. Bannon?  
 

Put it like this, with our roster construction, we’re not losing 100 games next year because of our 3B. It’s the SP. 

 

On 12/11/2021 at 2:29 PM, wildcard said:

Yep....... but 2/16 is very unlikely.   I'd say 1/2m.

1/$5.5 mm from the White Sox.   Good deal for the Sox IMO.

[wildcard]

15 minutes ago, Frobby said:

 

1/$5.5 mm from the White Sox.   Good deal for the Sox IMO.

I underestimated what Harrison would get but I  never thought he would be worth 5.5m to the O's as a stopgap.  I don't know if its a good deal for the White Sox.

[Frobby]

54 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I underestimated what Harrison would get but I  never thought he would be worth 5.5m to the O's as a stopgap.  I don't know if its a good deal for the White Sox.

I never thought he’d come as cheaply as you did.  I’m not sure he’d be worth $5.5 mm to the Orioles, but he probably is to the White Sox.