Forbes: O’s had $83 mm in operating income in 2021, but team value is down 4%

[Too Tall]

I still say tthe numbers tell me nothing re the detailed operation of the total franchise. I'm surely not impressed with total revenue which is on par with Tampa's. 

But let's assume something. We root for a franchise where the principal owner is aging and sick. The son's take over. They (the sons) hire a young general manager to rebuild the franchise from the ground up with the shared vision that such a rebuild if successful will make the franchise more valuable and be a step up for that young general manager. They agree to rebuild the minor leagues, invest in the use of data, expand significantly their international footprint, etc. All necessary and all positive investments in a franchise that for years had taken a back seat to doing what most other franchises were doing in that regard. Sort of build it and "winning" will come. So far, we see progress except for the winning.  And (and understatement) while there is varying degrees of patience on this board, we have no idea how either the son's or the general manager really view the current status - their patience or lack there-of, time line, etc. Conjecture is all we have.

Opinion - Forbes valuations are just numbers. Someone will pay what they see appropriate for any purchase. 

Opinion - Given what I  percieve out of all of this, I see a franchise being built back up the right way - finally -  and one being built to potentially sell.  

 

 

[TradeAngelos]

This ownership just keeps spitting in the face of the fans, and most of you just wipe it off and keep moving. 

I can't fathom how anyone can support this regime.  They have destroyed baseball in this city and most just keep hope alive!!

 

 

 

[Going Underground]

23 hours ago, Frobby said:

It’s a commentary both on the changes in revenue streams for all teams, and the particular decline in attendance for the O’s.

Does Forbes have the revenue for MASN in their equation? MASN is run as a separate entity with some revenue and expenses flowing through the Orioles bottom line 

[TradeAngelos]

4 minutes ago, Going Underground said:

Does Forbes have the revenue for MASN in their equation? MASN is run as a separate entity with some revenue and expenses flowing through the Orioles bottom line 

MASN? What is that? It does not exist to most around here. Provides no financial revenue, and never has. Has literally nothing to dso with the team or their finances. I bet someone will chime in and say it actually COSTS the team money and we should be thankful St Peter is so generous. 

Its a "separate entity" overall.  Yeah that is it. And the stooges believe it. 

That is where almost every MLB team not in the top 6 (well them too) makes all their money.  And everyone knows it, but they are just clinging to anything to make themselves feel better about this trash owner and the team. More power to them I guess to just keep their head buried in the sand.  

 

[JimGinSP]

4 hours ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Even if you assume average pay of 50% higher than minimums, the Orioles' total player salaries for their four full-season affiliates would work out to $1.8M a year.  Or about 2% of what we're calling operating expenses.  They're getting 100 minor leaguers for about the cost of Pedro Severino.

There may be some nuance I'm missing, but in general terms cutting Frederick was like eliminating one league-minimum MLB player.

My response to the OP was more about incremental savings between 2018 and now can be added to the $5.5m increase making it somewhat greater than it appears.   This is an organization that appears to be “penny wise”.   For example, I don’t think they would’ve been “pound foolish” if they had come to agreement with Means and Mancini but they didn’t.   They cut Pedro to save money too.   

The cost of Rapsodo technology (per unit) and eager beaver IT interns is pretty cheap.  
The analytic build up is probably less expensive than we might realize.  Sig’s salary is probably one of the biggest expenses. 

[Frobby]

3 hours ago, Going Underground said:

Does Forbes have the revenue for MASN in their equation? MASN is run as a separate entity with some revenue and expenses flowing through the Orioles bottom line 

No, MASN is not included, nor are other teams’ RSNs.   But, I did make a post in this thread that addressed what MASN’s profits were in 2012-16.   They’re not huge assuming the Nats prevail in the rights fee case.   But, they’re not nothing either.   

[Frobby]

14 hours ago, JimGinSP said:

Since the comparison goes back to 2018 possibly non-payroll expenses haven’t risen that much due to the elimination of one affiliate during that time plus a whole minor league season wiped out due to COVID.  I note that payroll category specifically states major league payroll. 
A smaller factor may be the contracts for Buck Showalter and Dan Duquette ran through 2018 and I imagine Brandon Hyde and Mike Elias are less expensive.

Of course no Joe Angel, Jim Hunter and Gary Thorne is most of it! 

I certainly expect Hyde is way less than Buck.  Not so sure about Elias, who was a pretty hot commodity in 2018.

Good point about the removal of team from our farm system.  

[eddie83]

Nice compliment for the Angelos family.