Elias sounds like he is shooting high

[DrinkinWithFermi]

I'd much rather sign 2 guys from the Syndergaard/Walker/Taillon/Heaney/Wacha tier than Rodon. I think it's better to spread the risk between 2 solid SPs than bet everything on a 6 figure mega-deal for a guy who has missed 8 or more starts in 5 of the last 6 years.

Verlander and Bassitt would be my top choices though.

[DrinkinWithFermi]

13 minutes ago, DrinkinWithFermi said:

I think it's better to spread the risk between 2 solid SPs than bet everything on a 6 figure mega-deal for a guy who has missed 8 or more starts in 5 of the last 6 years.

*a 9 figure mega-deal, derp

[Yardball85]

Seattle is shooting high.  They have traded for Teoscar Hernandez.  Will be interesting to see the return for the Jays. 

 

[Just Regular]

1 minute ago, Yardball85 said:

Seattle is shooting high.  They have traded for Teoscar Hernandez.  Will be interesting to see the return for the Jays. 

 

Just saw this.   Bet part of return is bringing Jesse Winker home to Buffalo-Toronto metro area where he can watch pitches like Craig Biggio and help them with L/R balance.

Kind of a fun challenge trade to the extent Julio and Vlad's teams got a little rowdy with each other last month.

[tabletop]

1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

Rodon IP starting the last 5 non COVID seasons:

2017: 69.1

2018: 120.2

2019: 34.2

2021: 132.2

2022:  178

535.1 IP over 5 years.

Can he give you even 600 IP the next 5 years?  

Can’t see committing that amount of money to someone that oft injured.

It’s nice that he did it this year but that’s not enough of a sample size to assume he can stay healthy well into his 30s.  It certainly could happen but I can’t see betting on that.

He has shoulder surgery and TJ surgery.  Last year he missed time because “something didn’t feel right” in his shoulder.

 

That's fair but out of the options I don't see anyone better. Rodon pitched more innings last year than deGrom did over his last two seasons so he seems safer than deGrom. I highly doubt Verlander would have any interest in coming to Baltimore.

[tabletop]

31 minutes ago, DrinkinWithFermi said:

I'd much rather sign 2 guys from the Syndergaard/Walker/Taillon/Heaney/Wacha tier than Rodon. I think it's better to spread the risk between 2 solid SPs than bet everything on a 6 figure mega-deal for a guy who has missed 8 or more starts in 5 of the last 6 years.

Verlander and Bassitt would be my top choices though.

2 of those guys combined might not be worth as much as Rodon (assuming health of course) on his own would be and would likely not be worth as much as Rodon + Kremer, Voth, etc. whoever the other pitcher not being bumped from the rotation is. I don't see how signing 2 or 3 of the middle tier pitchers moves this team to a true contender status.

[Aristotelian]

5 minutes ago, tabletop said:

That's fair but out of the options I don't see anyone better. Rodon pitched more innings last year than deGrom did over his last two seasons so he seems safer than deGrom. I highly doubt Verlander would have any interest in coming to Baltimore.

"I don't see anyone better" is a terrible reason to go spend $150M. I'd rather wait a year or two and spend $300M on someone we are excited about and have confidence in. Or trade for pitching and keep the cash for bats we have confidence in. 

[Sports Guy]

2 minutes ago, tabletop said:

2 of those guys combined might not be worth as much as Rodon (assuming health of course) on his own would be and would likely not be worth as much as Rodon + Kremer, Voth, etc. whoever the other pitcher not being bumped from the rotation is. I don't see how signing 2 or 3 of the middle tier pitchers moves this team to a true contender status.

Agreed.  Makes no sense to sign guys like that.

[tabletop]

4 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

"I don't see anyone better" is a terrible reason to go spend $150M. I'd rather wait a year or two and spend $300M on someone we are excited about and have confidence in. Or trade for pitching and keep the cash for bats we have confidence in. 

Waiting a year or two isn't going to help the team compete for a World Series next season. Plus, you never know who will be available.

[interloper]

Jays only got a reliever + prospect for Teoscar Hernandez. Only one year of control left for Hernandez, but still. That's about what we'd get for Santander alone, considering Santander's extra year of control but being a worse overall player than Hernandez. Fortunately, Elias has already said he doesn't see trading Santander, and I think we see why. You almost wonder if Hernandez would have had more value as a rental at the trade deadline to a desperate team. 

[DrinkinWithFermi]

7 minutes ago, tabletop said:

(assuming health of course) 

And there's the rub, there is no reason to assume health with Rodon when he has missed 25% or more of his starts in 5 of the last 6 years. 

6 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Agreed.  Makes no sense to sign guys like that.

It would certainly be a safer bet to provide value than signing Rodon.

Like I said though, I'd prefer Bassitt and/or Verlander.

[tabletop]

1 minute ago, DrinkinWithFermi said:

And there's the rub, there is no reason to assume health with Rodon when he has missed 25% or more of his starts in 5 of the last 6 years. 

It would certainly be a safer bet to provide value than signing Rodon.

Like I said though, I'd prefer Bassitt and/or Verlander.

I think Bassitt would be safer than Rodon but doesn't have nearly the same upside. I'd be thrilled if they signed Bassitt. I don't think Verlander would have any interest in Baltimore.

[Aristotelian]

18 minutes ago, tabletop said:

Waiting a year or two isn't going to help the team compete for a World Series next season. Plus, you never know who will be available.

There are other options, like trades, or going all in on Verlander. 

I'd like to see us compete next year but that doesn't mean we need to go all in right away, especially if it's a guy we're not thrilled about. We are set up to be competitive for the next 3-4 years at least and we're only getting better.  Is Rodon really the guy we want to build around? 

[Sports Guy]

Verlander wants the Scherzer deal, at least reportedly.  (Makes sense though)

[Yardball85]

54 minutes ago, Just Regular said:

Just saw this.   Bet part of return is bringing Jesse Winker home to Buffalo-Toronto metro area where he can watch pitches like Craig Biggio and help them with L/R balance.

Kind of a fun challenge trade to the extent Julio and Vlad's teams got a little rowdy with each other last month.

I was thinking the same thing, but it looks like Winker is staying put for now.  I am guessing Hernandez is a Haniger replacement.