I was worried about our starting rotation

[Just Regular]

46 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

How confident are you that Givens and Tate will be better/more consistent than the guys we are putting out there now?

First rule is hurt pitchers stay hurt but trusting both return to their typical selves at some point, very confident they will be sharper tools than Voth/Baumann or Hyde's other weakest options for ~50% of the remaining ~140 days this season.

A test of the culture Elias is building will be if Dillon Tate doesn't flip out if/when his options are deployed.

If Austin Voth hasn't been exposed to waivers in the next couple months, something will have gone wrong.

[Frobby]

3 minutes ago, Just Regular said:

 

If Austin Voth hasn't been exposed to waivers in the next couple months, something will have gone wrong.

Over his last 7 outings, Voth has an ERA of 1.64 and has allowed 8 base runners in 11 innings.  He allowed a run yesterday, but I thought his stuff was outstanding.  I’m in no hurry to see Voth go anywhere.   

[DirtyBird]

8 minutes ago, Just Regular said:

First rule is hurt pitchers stay hurt but trusting both return to their typical selves at some point

What is Mychel Givens typical self in recent years? 

How about Tate? You trust he will be back to 2022 production, or more like 2021?

[wildcard]

After a poor April the starters have settled in.   I think they continue to do well into July.   Then Means comes up and  GRod gets his innings lessened.    He only pitched 75 innings last year and Elias will be caution with him.  Not shut him down but maybe use him as an opener.  

Gibson, Bradish and Kremer have no innings limit.    Wells pitched 103 innings last year.   He can go 135 innings but they may lessen his starts late in the season by moving him to the pen.

Hall, Irvin, Rom, Watkins and Zimmermann can come up and eat innings as needed.

Edited May 11, 2023 by wildcard

[Sanfran327]

The reality of our rotation is that, at least for this season, they all have a decent ceiling, but they all also have a low floor. And each turn through the rotation will be a bit of a nail biter to see if we're going to get the good version of someone or the mediocre version. We shouldn't see too many turds, but probably not too many gems, either. So the bullpen will be under constant stress because this rotation is not really capable of going beyond 6 in a given night, and most nights, we'll be into the bullpen in the 5th. 

Yes, our starters are all capable of keeping us in games most nights. We've seen that since the beginning of the 2022 season, and I expect that to continue for the rest of this season and beyond. But until we get at least 2 SPs that are consistently going into (if not completing) the 7th inning, we'll have to keep playing the bullpen shuttle game. 

One old-timey adage that I still think is true is that you want your SPs to get 20 outs each night. Our guys usually get 15-17. Gotta get a little more efficient. 

[DirtyBird]

Bradish has had one good start so far. If he struggles again on Friday, could he be optioned for Irvin to get another chance?

[Matt Bennett]

8 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

Bradish has had one good start so far. If he struggles again on Friday, could he be optioned for Irvin to get another chance?

Cole Irvin can keep his 1.3 WHIP and <5.0 K/9 AAA numbers in Norfolk until a necessity arises. If then. We've seen Bradish dominate over an extended stretch (.607 OPS against in last 13 starts of 2022) and we need him to become that pitcher again. 20 something innings following an injury will not dissuade me 

[DirtyBird]

3 minutes ago, Matt Bennett said:

Cole Irvin can keep his 1.3 WHIP and <5.0 K/9 AAA numbers in Norfolk until a necessity arises. If then. We've seen Bradish dominate over an extended stretch (.607 OPS against in last 13 starts of 2022) and we need him to become that pitcher again. 20 something innings following an injury will not dissuade me 

He has never dominated over an extended stretch. He has dominated in a couple games over a 13 game stretch while mixing in terrible ones.

[Emory Eagle]

4 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

He has never dominated over an extended stretch. He has dominated in a couple games over a 13 game stretch while mixing in terrible ones.

Just with the eye test, looking at the quality of his pitches (not having checked stuff + data or what have you, don't have time but I'm fairly confident it backs this up), Bradish has a way higher ceiling than most pitchers in the organization.  I don't think there's any chance he's on the chopping block, unless there's some nagging injury concern.  I still think he has a chance to be the Os best SP this year (though I'm hoping they add someone with a more proven track record at the deadline).

Edited May 11, 2023 by Emory Eagle

[wildcard]

22 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

Bradish has had one good start so far. If he struggles again on Friday, could he be optioned for Irvin to get another chance?

Hall is close to passing Irvin in the next starter up race.   Hall stuff is much better and his control appears to be improving.

[Just Regular]

54 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

What is Mychel Givens typical self in recent years? 

How about Tate? You trust he will be back to 2022 production, or more like 2021?

I dunno, except Givens pulled millions from Elias, and Tate got tendered.     I doubt the 13 incumbents on the roster have Pipped them as functional performers.

I believe the Org will delay until performance data is near enough to their baseline to trust what OMAR expects will happen.     I don't believe relievers are who they are years at a time - its a daily game.

Tate's arm worries me more than Givens' knee, but I hope both will contribute.

I think Bradish gets long leash even if another clunker soon as on Matt Blood's paper, he's the #2 starter.

[DirtyBird]

 

7 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Hall is close to passing Irvin in the next starter up race.   Hall stuff is much better and his control appears to be improving.

He could be. Would like to see a couple more 6+ inning outing out of him like last night.

[interloper]

Still worried, but it's nice to see a bit of a rebound after the pitching face-plant in KC. 

I feel good about Wells and Gibson keeping us in games. I still feel like it's a total roll of the dice every time Kremer, Bradish, and Rodriguez step on the mound.

But...I'm encouraged by Grayson's grindy-ness - he's got some veteranosity to him already. I wish his stuff was playing more. Lotttttt of blue on that baseball savant page right now. https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/savant-player/grayson-rodriguez-680570?stats=statcast-r-pitching-mlb

Kremer seems to maybe have settled on an in-between persona that is neither full-rage Dean nor confidence-meltdown Dean. So that's good. To me he's a guy whose outings kind of depend on where he's at emotionally, and he's still learning who he is out there.

Bradish I feel confident he'll give you 4 good innings, and what he does with the next 1 or 2 innings sort of defines his outing. Capable of shutting down any offense if he's on. 

[Moose Milligan]

1 minute ago, interloper said:

Still worried, but it's nice to see a bit of a rebound after the pitching face-plant in KC. 

I feel good about Wells and Gibson keeping us in games. I still feel like it's a total roll of the dice every time Kremer, Bradish, and Rodriguez step on the mound.

But...I'm encouraged by Grayson's grindy-ness - he's got some veteranosity to him already. I wish his stuff was playing more. Lotttttt of blue on that baseball savant page right now. https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/savant-player/grayson-rodriguez-680570?stats=statcast-r-pitching-mlb

Kremer seems to maybe have settled on an in-between persona that is neither full-rage Dean nor confidence-meltdown Dean. So that's good. To me he's a guy whose outings kind of depend on where he's at emotionally, and he's still learning who he is out there.

Bradish I feel confident he'll give you 4 good innings, and what he does with the next 1 or 2 innings sort of defines his outing. Capable of shutting down any offense if he's on. 

I think this is a fair assessment.  I think the group as a whole is trending upward, which is good to see.  

Still want to see Kremer strike out more if he plans on throwing 95+.  

[Frobby]

45 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

Bradish has had one good start so far. If he struggles again on Friday, could he be optioned for Irvin to get another chance?

I think I’d look at it the other way - he’s only had one really bad start so far.  I think he’s got a fair amount of rope.