Pre winter meeting reliever notes

[Can_of_corn]

5 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

What do we trust more…

Kimbrel as closer with Wells the 5th SP

Wells as closer with Irvin or whoever takes Gibson/Lyles money 

I’d rather go with Kimbrel. He’s going to blow some saves but he’ll be good enough for us to win 95+ games again. 

You trust him in the playoffs?

[Sanity Check]

18 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Being a cheap ball club, we need a closer to get us through 162. Looking towards the playoffs is something Elias has to be willing to trade for at the deadline. It is what it is. Hader ain’t walking through that door. Kimbrel might. Maybe Robertson. 

If we're really going to upgrade the closer at the deadline, my math tells me that we only need the cheap closer to get us through about 112 games.  The last 50 games will use the upgraded closer if that is - in reality - what we do.

[Just Regular]

He's barely pitched in 2 years due to lower body stuff mostly, but I think @HakunaSakatahad a good brainstorm on Daniel Hudson the other day.

Reports were the Dodgers may have activated him had they advanced, when Kimbrel was being excluded from the top 12-13 options.

[waroriole]

2 hours ago, OsFanSinceThe80s said:

This is the Dylan Cease talk forum right now. Get with the program.

I know this forum has lost its collective mind over a guy with one outlier season. 

[E-D-D-I-E]

1 hour ago, Tony-OH said:

I agree that it's a longshot. Mostly because this team/ownership has shown no intention of signing that kind if talent due to the years and money it takes. Relievers can be volatile, but Hader has that special kind of talent that only an injury can derail.

Imagine a Bautista/Hader backend of the bullpen in 2025 and 2026? 

For me its Hall, Bautista, Hader. I really think he has taken that step to being a high-leverage arm. 

[Jim'sKid26]

3 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

Any team that gives Hicks 4/40 or more is just flat out stupid. Awful contract for a very overrated reliever.

I'm not certain I understand why you think he is "very overrated," and 4/40 is hardly a contract that handicaps the franchise moving forward. He just turned 27 so you are paying for age 27-31 (likely prime) years. He has, arguably, the best pure "stuff" of anyone on the market. He doesn't cost a draft pick. And he has been reasonably durable the last 2 years. I think this is what the market is for a reliever of his caliber. 

He should be a significant target for the O's IMHO.

[sportsfan8703]

17 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

You trust him in the playoffs?

Is there anyway that Bautista makes it back in September?

[E-D-D-I-E]

29 minutes ago, Sanity Check said:

THIS!  I've been interested in pretty girls before that I knew I'd never get.  Same thing here.  Can't hurt to declare interest and if one of them says, I really want to be in Baltimore and will consider taking less, then things just got interesting.  I don't see that happening, though.

You aren't missing anything! They are more trouble than they are worth.

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Is there anyway that Bautista makes it back in September?

Sure.

It has happened that guys make it back in less than a year.

[HakunaSakata]

1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

You just aren’t understanding. SSS get skewed by really good or really bad outings. You are just looking at his ERA and saying he was awful.

You are wrong. His ERA was skewed by a few bad outings and the rest of his numbers weren’t too bad. You also aren’t providing context that he had injury issues in 2019.

It’s called presenting the full picture and not being disingenuous with how you try to present your case. 
 

His statcast numbers have generally been very good. His K rates have been good. His K/Bb ratios have been good. His Hr rates have generally been solid. He is missing a ton of bats. 
 

 

You know that "really good" and "really bad" outings count just as much as the other outings right? And how 'bout you dial back the condescension a bit. Comments like "you aren't understanding" and "you are wrong" are ridiculous and unnecessary. 

[jamalshw]

9 minutes ago, E-D-D-I-E said:

For me its Hall, Bautista, Hader. I really think he has taken that step to being a high-leverage arm. 

I know there's some question on whether Cano can replicate what he did last year, but if he can this year with Cano, Hall, Wells and Hader, I would feel great about the last few innings of any game. And then adding in Bautista when he's healthy, you have two of the best closers in the game (one from each side) and a killer set up crew...all you would need from a starter would be 5 innings (and maybe even less in the playoffs). 

[clapdiddy]

3 minutes ago, jamalshw said:

I know there's some question on whether Cano can replicate what he did last year, but if he can this year with Cano, Hall, Wells and Hader, I would feel great about the last few innings of any game. And then adding in Bautista when he's healthy, you have two of the best closers in the game (one from each side) and a killer set up crew...all you would need from a starter would be 5 innings (and maybe even less in the playoffs). 

I would prefer to see Cano in less high-pressure situations.   Definitely don't want him coming into a game with runners on.    Pitching the 7th with a 2-run lead and no one on base is where I'd like to see him.

[Tony-OH]

26 minutes ago, E-D-D-I-E said:

For me its Hall, Bautista, Hader. I really think he has taken that step to being a high-leverage arm. 

I agree that Hall could definitely finish off a fantastic 3-headed monster at the back end of the bullpen.

[HakunaSakata]

Now you all can start speculating on a trade for Bieber AND Clase.

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2023/12/guardians-trade-rumors-emmanuel-clase.html

The Guardians are open to offers on All-Star closer Emmanuel Clase and willing to trade him for the right offer, ESPN’s Jeff Passan reports. Even if the club is merely performing its due diligence, it’s a fairly surprising development, given the overwhelmingly club-friendly contract to which the 25-year-old (26 in March) righty is signed.

Early in the 2022 season, Cleveland inked Clase to a five-year, $20MM contract extension that included affordable $10MM club options for the 2027-28 seasons (each with a $2MM buyout). He’s entering the third season of that deal, slated to earn $2.5MM this coming season, $4.5MM the following year and $6MM in 2026.

[Sports Guy]

28 minutes ago, Jim'sKid26 said:

I'm not certain I understand why you think he is "very overrated," and 4/40 is hardly a contract that handicaps the franchise moving forward. He just turned 27 so you are paying for age 27-31 (likely prime) years. He has, arguably, the best pure "stuff" of anyone on the market. He doesn't cost a draft pick. And he has been reasonably durable the last 2 years. I think this is what the market is for a reliever of his caliber. 

He should be a significant target for the O's IMHO.

He has good statcast numbers but other than that, his peripherals are very underwhelming.

If we could get him for a 2 year deal for 6-9M a year, I would take him but 4+ years for a guy with mediocre stats, poor control and poor command isn’t something that is very smart.

Now, maybe he figured something out in 2023, which saw his K rate jump up and maybe going forward he can be something more or maybe putting him with the right organization, he can blossom. He wouldn’t be the first reliever to do that later in their careers.

But there isn’t a lot of evidence that suggests that giving him that type of deal is smart.