Basallo for Miller y/n?

[Bemorewins]

1 minute ago, EddeeEddee said:

Not sure they would question Cowser's defense as much as Mayo's.  Maybe Basallo's too.  They may be more concerned about Cowser's bat.  Don't know why Kjerstad being 25 is such a big issue.  Mason Miller is also 25 and more likely to flame out than a hitter.  

I agree about Stowers but I think a deal for Norby, Stowers, McDermott and Tavera and maybe another player would be hard for the A's to be resist.  But I'm not paid to make these decisions so I don't know. 

Also, I'm not sure the likelihood the O's would think Miller would last 5 years throwing that hard.  They may be more comfortable trading less for a reliever who is a FA after this season or next, and I would not blame them.  You yourself said there will be a lot of relievers available, though I don't know how many better than Kimbrel.  

I think any team interested in Miller would want to see a couple more months of him before making an offer.

The defensive ability of those guys is a real issue. I agree with that.

The issue with the age, is that they would be willing to offload a 25 year uber talent, not in exchange for another 25 year old because that is not their time line. No matter how well Kjerstad/Stowers/Cowser, etc do now, it does nothing for the A’s because they don’t have a strong enough roster around those guys to win right now. Nor do they have the org structure to support winning because their franchise’s future is in so much flux right now given their possible relocation.

I am very confident that another suitor could and would beat a Norby, Stowers, McDermott and Tavera (and other spare part) offer.

In order to get real value, you have to give up real value (usually).

I agree that GMs will want to see/evaluate the Miller show for a bit more time before committing to trade for him. Thankfully the trade deadline is months away.

And yes, he is not/will not be our only option. But again, we won’t be able to find a better talent than him. 

[frankwhite]

7 minutes ago, Bemorewins said:

He’s not coming back this season. A starter is not what we need right now. Maybe if there are injuries by the deadline we may need that too? But right now with the roster as currently constructed, we don’t have a closer who Inwouod trust to pitch (and be consistently successful) in October.

Oh okay, you mentioned back-to-back World Series. I think we could add other pitchers not named Miller that could help, and it wouldn't have to include Basallo.

Burnes will more than likely not be returning. Means? Wells and Irvin? This isn't what we need right now? okay, so next year? Again, I feel using those type of players in a trade would be better using it for a starter. 

[Bemorewins]

Just now, frankwhite said:

Oh okay, you mentioned back-to-back World Series. I think we could add other pitchers not named Miller that could help, and it wouldn't have to include Basallo.

Burnes will more than likely not be returning. Means? Wells and Irvin? This isn't what we need right now? okay, so next year? Again, I feel using those type of players in a trade would be better using it for a starter. 

Next year’s problems/dilemmas will come when they arrive. And we can address those things when the appropriate time comes.

This season we are playing for a World Series and only have one weak spot on the team… high leverage, weapon at the back of the pen (closer).

[Philip]

1 hour ago, Bemorewins said:

That trade may not be there to be made. Who knows?

Let me ask you, would you rather trade Mayo or Basallo if you had to choose one?

Defense is important to me. I remember the excruciating development of Mountcastle, where some people insisted his defense was fine, even though he looked awful everywhere but first, and that’s where he ended up. I don’t want the same thing with Mayo or anyone else, for that matter, so sure, I’d trade Mayo(btw, Would you rather have Mayo or Westburg at 3B?)
The main point is that Miller is wasted on the As and they aren’t being responsible owners unless they turn him into as much Future Asset as possible. Most of the teams that Can trade for him don’t need him.

[Bemorewins]

3 minutes ago, Philip said:

Defense is important to me. I remember the excruciating development of Mountcastle, where some people insisted his defense was fine, even though he looked awful everywhere but first, and that’s where he ended up. I don’t want the same thing with Mayo or anyone else, for that matter, so sure, I’d trade Mayo(btw, Would you rather have Mayo or Westburg at 3B?)
The main point is that Miller is wasted on the As and they aren’t being responsible owners unless they turn him into as much Future Asset as possible. Most of the teams that Can trade for him don’t need him.

No doubt Westburg!

It looks to me that Mayo’s place on this team next season will be in RF/DH. 

[frankwhite]

12 minutes ago, Bemorewins said:

Next year’s problems/dilemmas will come when they arrive. And we can address those things when the appropriate time comes.

This season we are playing for a World Series and only have one weak spot on the team… high leverage, weapon at the back of the pen (closer).

I think we can get that help and win a world series without trading Basallo for it. Just because we don't consider it a problem now in May, doesn't mean it won't be. 

Edited May 3 by frankwhite

[Can_of_corn]

18 minutes ago, Bemorewins said:

Next year’s problems/dilemmas will come when they arrive. And we can address those things when the appropriate time comes.

This season we are playing for a World Series and only have one weak spot on the team… high leverage, weapon at the back of the pen (closer).

I think making moves that should improve the team over multiple seasons is preferable to patching holes as they appear.

[EddeeEddee]

4 minutes ago, Bemorewins said:

The defensive ability of those guys is a real issue. I agree with that.

The issue with the age, is that they would be willing to offload a 25 year uber talent, not in exchange for another 25 year old because that is not their time line. No matter how well Kjerstad/Stowers/Cowser, etc do now, it does nothing for the A’s because they don’t have a strong enough roster around those guys to win right now. Nor do they have the org structure to support winning because their franchise’s future is in so much flux right now given their possible relocation.

I am very confident that another suitor could and would beat a Norby, Stowers, McDermott and Tavera (and other spare part) offer.

In order to get real value, you have to give up real value (usually).

I agree that GMs will want to see/evaluate the Miller show for a bit more time before committing to trade for him. Thankfully the trade deadline is months away.

And yes, he is not/will not be our only option. But again, we won’t be able to find a better talent than him. 

I don't see the big deal with Kjerstad's age.  It's not like he's a free agent in 3 or even 4 years.  He's a rookie.

Now that I think about it some more maybe Mayo is more valuable than Basallo, but I think people are questioning Basallo more than they should because of a slow start.  

I also think the O's need to see how well their bullpen performs over the next month or two before dangling Top 25 prospects for a reliever.  

[Bemorewins]

2 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think making moves that should improve the team over multiple seasons is preferable to patching holes as they appear.

Miller would give us a great advantage this season and an even better next season when Bautista returns.

[Aristotelian]

6 minutes ago, Philip said:

The main point is that Miller is wasted on the As and they aren’t being responsible owners unless they turn him into as much Future Asset as possible. Most of the teams that Can trade for him don’t need him.

Has a rebuilding team ever in history traded a budding star with six years of control on the grounds that a couple years will be wasted? A comp might be us trading Mullins in the middle of his 30/30 season. Maybe it would have been the 3D chess move but you just don't see trades like that. Now Mullins is a key part of our core group now even though 2-3 years were "wasted". Even if they ultimately decide to trade him, I don't see his value declining any time soon. More likely the opposite. 

[Bemorewins]

2 minutes ago, EddeeEddee said:

I don't see the big deal with Kjerstad's age.  It's not like he's a free agent in 3 or even 4 years.  He's a rookie.

Now that I think about it some more maybe Mayo is more valuable than Basallo, but I think people are questioning Basallo more than they should because of a slow start.  

I also think the O's need to see how well their bullpen performs over the next month or two before dangling Top 25 prospects for a reliever.  

The age is a problem for the A’s because they are not ready to win now and he is already at his prime years. This is the whole reason that they would be reading a 25 yr old Miller. The future is what they are building toward.

[EddeeEddee]

20 minutes ago, Philip said:

Defense is important to me. I remember the excruciating development of Mountcastle, where some people insisted his defense was fine, even though he looked awful everywhere but first, and that’s where he ended up. I don’t want the same thing with Mayo or anyone else, for that matter, so sure, I’d trade Mayo(btw, Would you rather have Mayo or Westburg at 3B?)
The main point is that Miller is wasted on the As and they aren’t being responsible owners unless they turn him into as much Future Asset as possible. Most of the teams that Can trade for him don’t need him.

Yeah that's a good point about trading Miller for as much as possible -- implying quantity as well as quality.  What if the A's trade for Basallo and he turns out to be as mediocre as the start to this season?  The O's will probably trade more players if they don't have to trade one of Mayo or Basallo, and as deep as our farm system is quantity and quality should be able to be had together.  But if the A's ask for one of the top 3 guys they have to accept they won't get much of anyone else -- if anyone else.  More players from a deep system increases the chance of multiple quality players.

Defense is important to everyone.  I can't remember the last time the O's had so many good hitting prospects with such questionable defense.  But there were many years I was not paying attention, so maybe it's not such a new thing.

[Bemorewins]

2 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Has a rebuilding team ever in history traded a budding star with six years of control on the grounds that a couple years will be wasted? A comp might be us trading Mullins in the middle of his 30/30 season. Maybe it would have been the 3D chess move but you just don't see trades like that. Now Mullins is a key part of our core group now even though 2-3 years were "wasted". Even if they ultimately decide to trade him, I don't see his value declining any time soon. More likely the opposite. 

Mullins is a CF, Miller is a closer who has already had a significant arm injury. The two are not equivalent. 

Basically they would want to trade him (given the high probability of pitcher’s injuries) if/before something happens to him.

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Bemorewins said:

Mullins is a CF, Miller is a closer who has already had a significant arm injury. The two are not equivalent. 

Basically they would want to trade him (given the high probability of pitcher’s injuries) if/before something happens to him.

To say that Miller has had a significant arm injury would be, to me, the same as saying Bradish has had a significant arm injury.

Would you agree?

[Bemorewins]

4 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

To say that Miller has had a significant arm injury would be, to me, the same as saying Bradish has had a significant arm injury.

Would you agree?

I agree. Maybe the wrong wording by me. I should have said is at risk for significant arm injury.