The game I grew up with...

[Greg Pappas]

For point of reference, I'm 59... born in 1965 for the mathematically challenged. LOL!

Sports leagues, like the NFL and NBA, have changed notably over time.  Many sports have.  In some ways it was/is necessary... perhaps even inevitable with the advent of analytics and other factors.  MLB is no different in that regard.  But it's lost some of what once made it more exciting... more appealing.  

I LOVE the Orioles and am the most excited I've ever been about them, but I miss various things about baseball that were once normal.

• Singles up the middle:  It used to be that a batted ball that got past the pitcher up the middle was a hit.  It's no longer that easy.  Most balls hit up the middle seem to have a fielder awaiting the ball.  It's not The Shift, but still a shift of sorts.
• Players seem to have less bat control.  If a SS or 2B had the audacity to essentially play behind the pitcher, I feel many players from the 70's, 80's and even 90's would just hit the ball where the fielder wasn't.  
• Teams would average five K's per game, as opposed to over eight per game now. 
• Home runs and doubles are up, but triples are down. 
• Pitchers used to throw complete games (CG) quite often.  And having a reliever or two was usually enough to finish games that weren't CG's. Now if a guy can survive injuries and give you five or more innings, that's 'good.'

I could go on, but I have hope that some of what was once good can make a comeback.  Stolen bases are trending up again, so that's a start. 

What do you think?

Edited May 27 by Greg Pappas

[Too Tall]

I grew up with the 54 Orioles on. They were real bad at first. Left overs from the St. Louis Browns. Then there was the start/infusion of young players such as Brooks and Ron Hansen. The Baby Birds of the late 50's early 60's. It's 2024 and I feel at times like it's a replay. Relief pitchers in the 50's and 60's were hardly talked about. The first I remember to this day were Dick Hall and Stu Miller. Sure there were others but they still stand out to me. 

The game is so much different now. I can't say it's all good but I don't like "smart phones" or cars that tell you when you made a mistake or are about to make one. That's for reference. I'm an old fart kinda stuck in my ways. 

In my growing up time, you had your team and players that pretty much stayed around. No free agency - no constant analysis of everything. Winns - loses - batting averages - home runs - won/lost record - Era. 

I enjoy the wealth of information now - particularly about the minor leagues. I enjoy being able to watch the games or condensed versions if necessary. I don't get immersed in all the levels of statistics but am amazed how much more depth of analysis there is compared to when I grew up. Still if we had a pitcher close to 20 wins or a batter close to 50 home runs or 400 average, we and others would be talking. 

Back in The Day, you had maybe one or two "home run hitters." If a player struck out as much as they do today, they would be gone. Earl liked his three-run home run but you had to get two on before that could happen.

Yesterday was exciting with how it ended but getting there was frustrating as all get out. I like an offense that makes a pitcher work and in turn works him over. I've seen such teams in the past and would love to do so again.

[Guest]

I like the time clock on the pitchers. Great idea. I hate the extra inning ghost runners. And the  inter league play. 

Edited May 26 by Phil Beckett
Mistakes were made

[Bemorewins]

1 hour ago, Greg Pappas said:

For point of reference, I'm 59... born in 1965 for the mathematically challenged. LOL!

Sports leagues, like the NFL and NBA, have changed notably over time.  Many sports have.  In some ways it was/is necessary... perhaps even inevitable with the advent of analytics and other factors.  MLB is no different in that regard.  But it's lost some of what once made it more exciting... more appealing.  

I LOVE the Orioles and am the most excited I've ever been about them, but I miss so many things about baseball that were once normal.

• Singles up the middle:  It used to be that a batted ball that got past the pitcher up the middle was a hit.  It's no longer that easy.  Most balls hit up the middle seem to have a fielder awaiting the ball.  It's not The Shift, but still a shift of sorts.
• Players seem to have less bat control.  If a SS or 2B had the audacity to essentially play behind the pitcher, I feel many players from the 70's, 80's and even 90's would just hit the ball where the fielder wasn't.  
• Teams would average five K's per game, as opposed to over eight per game now. 
• Home runs and doubles are up, but triples are down. 
• Pitchers used to throw complete games (CG) quite often.  And having a reliever or two was usually enough to finish games that weren't CG's. Now if a guy can survive injuries and give you five or more innings, that's 'good.'

I could go on, but I have hope that some of what was once good can make a comeback.  Stolen bases are trending up again, so that's a start. 

What do you think?

Pitchers are more skilled than they ever have been before in the history of the game, with the velocities being higher than ever and movement being sharper than ever.

It’s not that hitters don’t have bat control, it’s that most of the time you are only going to get one to two pitches to hit per at bat (at most). 

The game is different overall. But as we all learn the older we get, the only constant in life is change. What are you are describing is the evolution of the game, which has taken place in all sports and will continue to go on as long as they are played.

[Cheetos]

I started following the O’s in the early 80s.  The game has changed for sure, but I don’t miss how the game is played as much as I miss the way you enjoy the game.  I miss This Week In Baseball with Mel Allen, the excitement of the O’s playing on Saturday’s NBC game of the Week, Brother Low’s and Mel Poctor in HTS,  staying up late listening to west coast games through the static of the broadcast on AM radio and Rex Barney giving a fan a contract.  

[yark14]

With the emergence of advanced scouting/analytics, high speed motion tracking cameras, and soon Artificial Intelligence (if it isn't used already), the game is going to change a lot over the next decade.  Also, youth development is completely changing.  Gone are the days of kids playing 2-4 sports as a youth and even into high school.  Now kids play baseball nearly all year with travel ball and elite camps.  Just the other day Perfect Game tweeted the list of top pitching velos for 12 year old kids (lots of future TJ surgeries).

 

[Chavez Ravine]

I’m old school—particularly when it comes to technology. How has the key fob improved my life?? But, I am glad that the style of play changes. The world rolls on. The dudes playing change. The people assembling the teams change. It’s interesting, exciting, new. 

[gtman55]

I'm 69. The first game I went to as a kid, Jim Gentile was at first base.

Has the game changed?. Of course. And the players are bigger, faster, stronger. But it's still the game we love and seeing the Orioles finally be fun again is awesome 

 

 

[CallMeBrooksie]

35 minutes ago, Chavez Ravine said:

I’m old school—particularly when it comes to technology. How has the key fob improved my life?? But, I am glad that the style of play changes. The world rolls on. The dudes playing change. The people assembling the teams change. It’s interesting, exciting, new. 

Key fobs didn't improve your life, but they've added some value for your employer most likely

[Gentile4]

22 minutes ago, gtman55 said:

I'm 69. The first game I went to as a kid, Jim Gentile was at first base.

Has the game changed?. Of course. And the players are bigger, faster, stronger. But it's still the game we love and seeing the Orioles finally be fun again is awesome 

 

 

This might as well be me. Diamond Jim was my favorite player, and I still can't believe they traded him for Norm F'ing Siebern. I have little interest in the new analytics and am happy following the traditional statistics I embraced as a youngster. That said, I wouldn't mind a CG now and then.

[Jim'sKid26]

And.......wait for it.........cue @DrungoHazewood

Standby for heavy rolls.....

[sevastras]

I miss brutal collisions at second or at the plate. I know it isn’t great for the players, but I still miss it. I miss a fastball to the ribs after someone shows up the pitcher. I miss the occasional brawl. 

[Aristotelian]

I'm good with the changes. I thought the shift was cool and creative. I think the steroid era was probably my least favorite in hindsight. For the most part I like where the game is at now. 

Replay is great but bring on the robo umps. 

[DrungoHazewood]

18 hours ago, Greg Pappas said:

For point of reference, I'm 59... born in 1965 for the mathematically challenged. LOL!

Sports leagues, like the NFL and NBA, have changed notably over time.  Many sports have.  In some ways it was/is necessary... perhaps even inevitable with the advent of analytics and other factors.  MLB is no different in that regard.  But it's lost some of what once made it more exciting... more appealing.  

I LOVE the Orioles and am the most excited I've ever been about them, but I miss various things about baseball that were once normal.

• Singles up the middle:  It used to be that a batted ball that got past the pitcher up the middle was a hit.  It's no longer that easy.  Most balls hit up the middle seem to have a fielder awaiting the ball.  It's not The Shift, but still a shift of sorts.
• Players seem to have less bat control.  If a SS or 2B had the audacity to essentially play behind the pitcher, I feel many players from the 70's, 80's and even 90's would just hit the ball where the fielder wasn't.  
• Teams would average five K's per game, as opposed to over eight per game now. 
• Home runs and doubles are up, but triples are down. 
• Pitchers used to throw complete games (CG) quite often.  And having a reliever or two was usually enough to finish games that weren't CG's. Now if a guy can survive injuries and give you five or more innings, that's 'good.'

I could go on, but I have hope that some of what was once good can make a comeback.  Stolen bases are trending up again, so that's a start. 

What do you think?

I think that appreciating the past is fine, I'm a huge fan of baseball history, especially the early game. But it's hard to say any era is objectively better than any other. Most of the strategic and tactical changes to the game over the past 50 years or so are driven by the desire (need?) to win more games and keep up with the innovations every other team constantly makes. The information revolution has changed baseball by giving teams the tools to optimize what used to be mostly hunches and traditions. Much of what is often thought of as going backwards (no bat control!) is mostly a side-effect of other advancements, like the knowledge that power is unambiguously more valuable than place-hitting, and that wall-to-wall max effort pitchers with wipeout sweepers are the driving factor for the strikeout increases (not batters who don't care if they K). If Joe DiMaggio played today he'd strike out 75 or 100 times a year. Mickey Mantle faced a pitcher a 4th time in a game 1000 times more than Mike Trout.

Complete games are dead because pitchers typically throw at 110% effort all the time, and if they threw nine innings a start they'd break down even more quickly than today. I saw people on social media complaining that Bradish wasn't allowed to try to get his no-hitter. That's a great idea if you really don't care if Bradish's elbow makes it through Father's Day in one piece. This isn't 1980, when you could throw an 88 mph Major League Fastball and get people out without jeopardizing your UCL on every pitch.

If you want to see what happens when a team stays stuck in the past, clinging to ways of running the team and using analytics and developing players like it's 40 years ago just look at the 1998-2011 Orioles. I've always thought they were a pretty cutting-edge team for 1975. If you sit still you will lose, and often badly.

If the fans as a whole really want strategies like complete games to come back there are certainly ways to do that, from incentives and indirect pressure (say, limiting teams to eight or nine pitchers on the roster and very few minor league transactions) to the more direct (the starter has to go seven innings unless he's given up 7+ runs, or is hurt, and if he comes out injured he can't pitch for three weeks). But baseball has traditionally been very, very reluctant to change rules. The DH is 50 years old and some people still moan and whine about that. The pitch clock is really just enforcing rules that have been on the books forever, and some people seem to hate that. Since baseball hasn't changed the environment to make the game more like 1960, I have to think the general opinion is that the way the game is today is thought of more favorably than the rules changes that would be necessary to bring back some of the things Greg talks about above.

Also, the trend for increasing homers and decreasing triples is over a century old (triples and homers per game):

1871: 0.94, 0.19
1881: 0.45, 0.11
1891: 0.57, 0.26
1901: 0.56, 0.21
1911: 0.53, 0.21
1921: 0.55, 0.36
1931: 0.43, 0.42
1941: 0.37, 0.51
1951: 0.29, 0.75
1961: 0.26, 0.95
1971: 0.21, 0.74
1981: 0.24, 0.64
1991: 0.21, 0.80
2001: 0.19, 1.19
2011: 0.18, 0.94
2021: 0.14, 1.22

By WWII you could have noticed a long-standing trend of triples fading away and homers steadily increasing. Smaller parks play a role, but probably a more important factor is better outfielders.

And doubles are actually down a bit from a high in the mid 2000s. Most doubles ever were 2007, followed by 2006, 2008, 2004, and 2000. We're down from almost two doubles a game to 1.6 this year, which is right in line with the live ball era (1920-present) average.

Edited May 27 by DrungoHazewood

[SemperFi]

3 hours ago, DrungoHazewood said:

By WWII you could have noticed a long-standing trend of triples fading away and homers steadily increasing. Smaller parks play a role, but probably a more important factor is better outfielders.

 

You can add the trend to symetrical parks, and thanks to Pete Reiser padded walls and warning tracks.  OF's also generally play much deeper than they did in previous eras.

Edited May 27 by SemperFi