Jump to content

Orioles Pitching Strategy compared to competition

casadeozo

By casadeozo
in Orioles Talk

 Share

Recommended Posts

casadeozo Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

casadeozo

Posted
Posted

Obviously much has been made of the orioles dire need to add pitching at the deadline as well as our lack of depth in the minor leagues.
 

Add to that we had another draft last night without drafting a pitcher in the first two rounds. This clearly is an organization strategy. 
 

This got me to thinking, who are our peers around the league utilizing a similar strategy?

Elias’ former employer the Houston Astros seem to continue to find gems when their pitching injuries pile up (Ronel Blanco, Hunter brown) Even Arrighetti has been solid.

In addition, the Dodgers and Rays are two well run organizations who have also been decimated by pitching injuries but have been able to stay competitive due to lots of depth in their system.

Has this strategy been used successfully before?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
jabba72 Hangout Veteran Council

jabba72

Posted
Posted

I was really hoping they picked Brecht so it kind of hurts when he was still there at #32. Pretty clear a pre-determined draft strategy was in play. They are doubling down on up-the-middle players early in the draft.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
casadeozo Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

casadeozo

Posted
  • Author
Posted
8 minutes ago, jabba72 said:

I was really hoping they picked Brecht so it kind of hurts when he was still there at #32. Pretty clear a pre-determined draft strategy was in play. They are doubling down on up-the-middle players early in the draft.

Perhaps the idea is to create so much depth of college hitters you can trade that depth for pitching but that’s really hasn’t been seen at least as of yet.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Orioles0615 Hangout Grand Counsel

Orioles0615

Posted
Posted
Just now, casadeozo said:

Perhaps the idea is to create so much depth of college hitters you can trade that depth for pitching but that’s really hasn’t been seen at least as of yet.

Not only have we not seen this, but teams want minor league arms for arms. 

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Spy Fox Hangout Veteran Council

Spy Fox

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, casadeozo said:

Perhaps the idea is to create so much depth of college hitters you can trade that depth for pitching but that’s really hasn’t been seen at least as of yet.

We've seen it a bit. Hernaiz for Irvin, and Ortiz/Hall for Burnes were both moves to acquire big league pitching help from the stockpile of hitting prospects. 

Another move or two in the same vein may be coming this month. If not, I'll be pretty confused. 

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
jabba72 Hangout Veteran Council

jabba72

Posted
Posted
16 minutes ago, casadeozo said:

Perhaps the idea is to create so much depth of college hitters you can trade that depth for pitching but that’s really hasn’t been seen at least as of yet.

That seems like the plan. Elias did also get Povich, McDermott and Seth Johnson  (and a few other arms) through trades, those guys just haven't made an impact yet.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Roll Tide Hangout Grand Counsel

Roll Tide

Posted
Posted
19 minutes ago, casadeozo said:

Perhaps the idea is to create so much depth of college hitters you can trade that depth for pitching but that’s really hasn’t been seen at least as of yet.

The problem I’m having is we seem to have a considerable drop off in talent after Norby in our “loaded system”. Theyve obviously been unable to get value for the surplus of Norby, Stowers, and the gaggle of big league talent that prevents deserved call ups. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
jabba72 Hangout Veteran Council

jabba72

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

The problem I’m having is we seem to have a considerable drop off in talent after Norby in our “loaded system”. Theyve obviously been unable to get value for the surplus of Norby, Stowers, and the gaggle of big league talent that prevents deserved call ups. 

Maybe this year will be the deadline that Norby and Stowers get "The Call" and are dealt. I'm sure their hoping for it. Though I've seen other posters mention they are more valuable to us in a depth role starting next year.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
G54377 Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

G54377

Posted
Posted

It’s definitely a little concerning none of our starters (or even high level prospects) were drafted by Elias. They were either here when his regime got here, or we traded for them. Eventually we have to draft and develop pitchers of our own. Part of that is obviously that we really haven’t drafted many pitchers.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Roll Tide Hangout Grand Counsel

Roll Tide

Posted
Posted
17 minutes ago, jabba72 said:

Maybe this year will be the deadline that Norby and Stowers get "The Call" and are dealt. I'm sure their hoping for it. Though I've seen other posters mention they are more valuable to us in a depth role starting next year.

I hear you …but these guys need to play…not “depth roles”.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
gamiliel AAA

gamiliel

Posted
Posted
49 minutes ago, jabba72 said:

Maybe this year will be the deadline that Norby and Stowers get "The Call" and are dealt. I'm sure their hoping for it. Though I've seen other posters mention they are more valuable to us in a depth role starting next year.

I think the years of control are more valuable than a relief pitcher unless he is elite (I don't think any of those are available) or has at least two more years beyond this year of control. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Aristotelian Hangout Grand Counsel

Aristotelian

Posted
Posted
42 minutes ago, G54377 said:

It’s definitely a little concerning none of our starters (or even high level prospects) were drafted by Elias. They were either here when his regime got here, or we traded for them. Eventually we have to draft and develop pitchers of our own. Part of that is obviously that we really haven’t drafted many pitchers.

Concerning, yes. But I wouldn't say we have to develop our own. We have a below average payroll and plenty of surplus talent we can use to fill holes. I have to say, Elias does seem to be somewhat of an extremist in the "grow the bats, buy the arms" strategy. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
LookitsPuck Hangout Grand Counsel

LookitsPuck

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, G54377 said:

It’s definitely a little concerning none of our starters (or even high level prospects) were drafted by Elias. They were either here when his regime got here, or we traded for them. Eventually we have to draft and develop pitchers of our own. Part of that is obviously that we really haven’t drafted many pitchers.

That’s not concerning at all. Burnes, Bradish, Suarez all acquired by Elias. Tyler Wells, Cade Povich as well.

The strategy can work. And there are some potential options in the minors: McDermott, Johnson.

Think Elias has done wonders at piecing together a bullpen.

I do think he needs to trade for a controllable starter, and Rubenstein needs to open that pocket book in the offseason.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
 Share
Go to topic listing


  • Posts

    • interloper
      Should we kick the tires on Hector Neris?

      By interloper · Posted

      If you look closer than just ERA, he's been terrible. 
    • LookitsPuck
      Craig Kimbrel 2024

      By LookitsPuck · Posted

      He was excellent earlier in the year when his velocity was a few ticks higher, but it’s dropped as well as his command. I was OK with the Kimbrel acquisition. I was not ok with it being the only real reliever acquired outside of Elias’s typical waiver diving approach.
    • LookitsPuck
      Should we kick the tires on Hector Neris?

      By LookitsPuck · Posted

      I think the issue with Brandon Young is he's both unproven and has not operated as a reliever much at all this year. He's apparently made, what, 3 appearances as a reliever with 33 PA (which would be more like a middle/long reliever). Personally, I'd like Young as an option in September when rosters expand, and I'd like Rogers optioned as Povich given the rotation spot. Young is intriguing, though. But there's a world in which you can have Young *and* Neris. 
    • Uli2001
      Craig Kimbrel 2024

      By Uli2001 · Posted

      This was a bet by Elias that really blew up in his face. To pay this much money for this kind of performance.
    • LookitsPuck
      Should we kick the tires on Hector Neris?

      By LookitsPuck · Posted

      Pretty funny that Jorge Lopez has made Hector Neris expendable, whereas if the O's just picked up Jorge Lopez *FOR FREE*, we aren't having this conversation. You have to ask yourself the following: Is Hector Neris better than any of the following: Seranthony Dominguez - no Craig Kimbrel - maybe Yennier Cano - no Cionel Perez - maybe Colin Selby - yes Burch Smith - no (situationally) Gregory Soto - yes Keegan Akin - no I don't think there's a world in which Elias admits that Kimbrel is cooked and cuts him. Just not going to happen. So he's off the table. That leaves Perez with 2 years left of control, so don't think he's going anywhere. Gregory Soto who was just acquired by drastically overpaying for him and his extra year of service and his inability to get righties out with all of his control issues, but I don't think Elias admits defeat with Soto since he just overpaid for him *and* talked about his extra year of service. So he's not going anywhere, unfortunately. So this really leaves Colin Selby. Selby has options, something Elias loves. Neris doesn't have options.  Rosters expand soon, but you can only have 14 pitchers. So that's 1 extra arm. I could see a world where they option Selby, pickup Neris and then when rosters expand bring up Young and Selby and do funny things with the rotation to keep guys fresh. To me I like Hector Neris more than a couple guys in the bullpen right now. The WHIP sucks, similar to Soto, he also stinks against righties, similar to Soto. But if we look at his last, let's call 20 game sample, Neris has only allowed earned runs in 5 of them. 2 of the 5 have been more than 1 run.  So, maybe you don't anoint him the closer, but he's definitely better than some of the guys in the pen. Why not? Elias already missed on one bullpen arm that cost nothing, and instead we are calling up Selby and giving time to Kimbrel, Soto and putting guys like Perez in sticky situations more often than not. 
    • Uli2001
      Just how bad is the Orioles bullpen this year?

      By Uli2001 · Posted

      The bullpen has had a worse performance in the second half than in the first half, in both 2023 and 2024. So it would be interesting to see the rankings for the second-half only (the one that is likely to be reproduced in the playoffs). In part, this was due to injuries. But this is part of the game, all teams have it. If other teams are doing better, it's because they have more depth or a plan B.
    • 1fingerwillie
      Soto up, Mayo down

      By 1fingerwillie · Posted

      We have one roster spot coming available in September. We also have on obvious player to send to the minors in Soto. Mountie and O'Hearn are here through the season. Thus we have 2 spots for 3 players that most expect to be on the roster in September.

  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...