If Mateo gets an operation elbow does that lead to Orioles leaving him of the 40 man this offseason?

[Gurgi]

Was just reading that Mateo might still need to have an operation on the elbow.  Would we keep him on the 40 man or protect some prospect and risk someone picking Mateo up?  We all pretty much know what his ceiling is now.  It pretty much is a utility/pinch runner.  All be it that he is a very very good defensive utility guy.  I think we don't protect him.  

[gamiliel]

Anyone who saw the injury knew he was done for the year and surgery is not surprising. He is probably done with us. His game won't age well. 

[Aristotelian]

23 minutes ago, Gurgi said:

Was just reading that Mateo might still need to have an operation on the elbow.  Would we keep him on the 40 man or protect some prospect and risk someone picking Mateo up?  We all pretty much know what his ceiling is now.  It pretty much is a utility/pinch runner.  All be it that he is a very very good defensive utility guy.  I think we don't protect him.  

Couldn't we put him on the 60 day IL?

[eddie83]

They need a utility INF. I think he stays. 

[LA2]

I feel very bad for Jorge Mateo and wish him a sound recovery. So unfortunate that the collision with Henderson happened at a time when he had seemed finally to find his proper niche on a winning Oriole roster. His absence has had a bigger impact on the team's performance and entertainment value than most fans probably expected.

[DrinkinWithFermi]

Mateo is making $2.7 million this year and will be due another raise in arbitration for 2025 before reaching free agency after the season. 

If the surgery requires a recovery time that would push back his start to the season or if there is reason to think it will sap his already meager offensive output (even temporarily), then I think we have probably seen Jorge play his last game as an Oriole. 

[AlbNYfan]

20 minutes ago, LA2 said:

I feel very bad for Jorge Mateo and wish him a sound recovery. So unfortunate that the collision with Henderson happened at a time when he had seemed finally to find his proper niche on a winning Oriole roster. His absence has had a bigger impact on the team's performance and entertainment value than most fans probably expected.

Bingo!! The loss of Westburg and Mateo have had a huge impact IMO. What is our record with them and without them? Just having some infield flexibility. The O's have been forced to play Holliday everyday, even with mismatches. BTW, I hate when people bring up cost of a guy like Mateo, 2.7 million is nothing and won't have any influence on the team's signing of FA's. If that is the determiner of Mateo's future then Rubenstein is cheap (and I don't think that is the case).

[wildcard]

There is a spot for Mateo on the 2025 team If he is healthy.   He currently has a 799 OPS vs lefties.   Will Holliday hit lefties? 

Whether he stays on the roster probably depends on how much time he is projected to miss with the injury.

[DrinkinWithFermi]

22 minutes ago, AlbNYfan said:

BTW, I hate when people bring up cost of a guy like Mateo, 2.7 million is nothing

If you exclude his 2022 outlier season, Mateo has been worth a combined 1.7 rWAR/1.6 fWAR for his entire career, and $2.7 million is what he is making in 2024. That number will go up in 2025.

That sure sounds like a non-tender candidate to me.

You also seem to have missed the part of my post about his recovery time and prognosis factoring into the final decision. If he is going to be out recovering from major elbow surgery until June or July, then we could probably invest the $3.5 million or so that he will make next year on someone who will provide more than like 0.4 WAR to the 2025 team.

[Legend_Of_Joey]

1 hour ago, Aristotelian said:

Couldn't we put him on the 60 day IL?

Once the season ends, all IL's are basically voided and everyone must be added back to the roster.

[Aristotelian]

10 minutes ago, Legend_Of_Joey said:

Once the season ends, all IL's are basically voided and everyone must be added back to the roster.

Ah, got it. But in that case the surgery is irrelevant, either we plan to keep him or we don't. 

[Chromehill]

You non-tender him and hope he accepts a non-roster invitation to spring training.   

[Sports Guy]

52 minutes ago, wildcard said:

There is a spot for Mateo on the 2025 team If he is healthy.   He currently has a 799 OPS vs lefties.   Will Holliday hit lefties? 

Whether he stays on the roster probably depends on how much time he is projected to miss with the injury.

Holliday is going to be an every game type guy.

[DrinkinWithFermi]

Just now, Aristotelian said:

Ah, got it. But in that case the surgery is irrelevant, either we plan to keep him or we don't. 

The expected recovery time is very relevant to whether or not we should pay him $3-4 million dollars in 2025. If he is going to miss the first couple months of the season, then that money would probably be better spent elsewhere.

1 minute ago, Chromehill said:

You non-tender him and hope he accepts a non-roster invitation to spring training.   

If he is expected to be back before, say, the end of June, then someone like the Marlins or White Sox would probably give him a modest guaranteed contract and hope he performs well enough to flip him to a contender at the deadline.

[Safelykept]

31 minutes ago, DrinkinWithFermi said:

If you exclude his 2022 outlier season, Mateo has been worth a combined 1.7 rWAR/1.6 fWAR for his entire career, and $2.7 million is what he is making in 2024. That number will go up in 2025.

That sure sounds like a non-tender candidate to me.

You also seem to have missed the part of my post about his recovery time and prognosis factoring into the final decision. If he is going to be out recovering from major elbow surgery until June or July, then we could probably invest the $3.5 million or so that he will make next year on someone who will provide more than like 0.4 WAR to the 2025 team.

If he gets non tendered i would think it would be injury related. Heck, they tendered him after last years disaster. Was paying much better this year. Dont confuse anybody's defense at 2nd with Mateo, plus can back up SS. Big speed. He was a nice piece fo us.