I think we need to be worried about Chen.

[mweb]

Go back to page 3 (as painful as it might be).

Bryan made his statement (whatever it was).

SG then says something along the lines of "you weren't the only one who predicted this."

I simply pointed out that if anyone deserves the credit (thus far), it should be Bryan because he was the most boisterous about it.

Is it too early to be taking "credit" for this? Absolutely (and I said this same thing somewhere along page 4 or 5).

Again, thus far Bryan has been right. Simple as that.

Why people get so upset by that is beyond me.

I'm not upset. I just don't think there should even be credit involved yet in this situation. Saying he deserves credit thus far is still saying he deserves credit, so i'll refer you back to the what you quoted.

And I'll also quote you: "Yes, you did - and it was quickly pointed out that Bryan was the most boisterous person about it on here, and should receive credit for it."

Forgot a thus far.

[mweb]

I didn't forget anything - it wasn't needed.

Ok, your confusing me now. Why isn't it needed?

[mweb]

Because it apparently wasn't that big of a deal at that point.

What the hell does it matter?

You obviously thinks this matters or you'd stop posting about it. But thanks for the warm response. Like I said, I don't think anyone deserves credit yet regarding Chen.

[mweb]

Stop posting about what?

I am defending someone. People keep trying to attack me about it - I will most definitely attack back.

What a joke.

Show me where I attacked you?

[Cokeman]

Muskrat!

(sorry, I just saw Meet the Fockers again the other day)

[wildcard]

How long do Lopez and Chen have?

Before one of them gets pushed to the bullpen.

My answer would be at least two more starts.

The fact is there is no one ready in the minors to enter the starting rotation and it will be at least 10 days and two impressive starts before such a move could be made - barring an injury.

Hayden Penn - was the minor leaguer that was closest to the majors when spring training started. He is still in Florida strengthing his arm and is probably at least three starts away from even being considered for a call up.

Cory Morris - Good 2005 at Bowie and good ST has put him in position to be the first guy called up, however he is not stretched out. He went 4 innings in his most recent start. The O's would probably like to see him go 6 innings before he would get a call up to be a starter.

Kirk Birkins - Good start at AAA but most reports say this lefties' stuff is nothing special. His path to the majors is probably through the bullpen.

JJ Johnson - Has the arm, the stuff but not the experience -yet. Having a good start at AA. He is probably the guy behind Morris at this point in the rankings for a call up but mid season would be a more likely time to see him get the call. Its a little soon.

Adam Loewen - Has the arm and the stuff but not the consistent control. Needs more time.

Brian Finch - See Loewen

Craig Anderson - Off to a great start at Bowie but has had a poor season at AAA and probably needs to go to Ottawa and slay that dragon before he gets called to the majors.

Richard Stahl - A good start at least gets him a mention. This 1st rounder who had fallen out of sight still has much to prove when it comes to control.

This all adds up to at least two more starts for Lopez and Chen to prove that they belong in the rotation instead of in the bullpen. However, if Morris and/or JJ pitch two starts lights out and Chen and/or Lopez keep giving up five runs a start, this could get interesting.

[Frobby]

First off, yes you are against DIPS. :002_stongue:

As for the rest, I agree completely that you can't base anything on four starts - and that is exactly why I have been purposely using qualifiers such as "thus far."

And no, none of the other stuff proves anything, including Chen.

As for your last paragraph, that is exactly where Bryan has been right thus far (just wanted to highlight that for you). He didn't expect Chen to just "come back to earth", he expected him to fall off the face of the earth (so to speak).

No, I'm not really against DIPS. I think it is fair, when a pitcher's ERA is drastically below his DIPS ERA, to expect it to swing back the other way the following year.

7.84 is not "swinging back the other way." It is awful. But I have confidence in Chen's ability to turn things around and put together a decent season.

In answer to wildcard's question about how long we stick with Chen and Lopez, I would think they will be in the rotation until close to the end of May no matter how poorly they pitch.

[wildcard]

In answer to wildcard's question about how long we stick with Chen and Lopez, I would think they will be in the rotation until close to the end of May no matter how poorly they pitch.

You are a patient man. That is 6 to 7 more starts. If either one of them does not turn it around, I do not see them staying in the rotation that long.

Say Chen goes 0-5 or 0-6. I think he is in the pen.

I think the likelihood is that both of them will start to pitch best in their next two starts and the speculation will go away.

However, if either does not improve and Morris, Johnson or Penn is on a streak, I can easily see a change being made in a couple of more starts.

[Sports Guy]

Well they keep putting Conine in, so yea i think these guys get at least another month.

[wildcard]

Well they keep putting Conine in, so yea i think these guys get at least another month.

At least Conine is driving in runs. His competition for playing time is Terrero and Patterson. That explains a lot right there.

[erb8472]

At least Conine is driving in runs. His competition for playing time is Terrero and Patterson. That explains a lot right there.

I would think Conine's competition for playing time was Markakis and not Patterson and Terrero. That being the case it's sad that they keep running him out there on a daily basis. If they are going to play Conine they should at least let Nick get at bats in Center. I feel much better about one of Markakis and one of Conine/Terrero/Patterson then I do with two out of Conine/Terrer/Patterson.