A few things

[El Gordo]

Greater - yeah, I will buy that.

"Much" greater- I am not sure.

If Reimold has a good year this year- my money shifts to him.

Their minor league stats are pretty close.

Considering that Bay has put up .900+ OPS 6 out of 7 years in the ML I would say much greater. A good year for Reimold would be Bay's poorest year, last year. At 29 recovering from an injury last season I wouldn't be to worried about Bay not bouncing back.

[Boy Howdy]

Anyone believe that trading for Bay increases our chances of signing Bedard to a long term extension. I think Bay is from Canada and could click with Bedard. Maybe they both sign extensions. Not a bad core to build around for years 2009-2015.

I've been meaning to ask Peace if it's true that Bedard is demanding that his next O's contract requires "O Canada" to played before all Baltimore home games.

Jauss & Kranitz will also be re-assigned and replaced by Bob & Doug McKenzie.

[66-70-83-??]

Anyone believe that trading for Bay increases our chances of signing Bedard to a long term extension. I think Bay is from Canada and could click with Bedard. Maybe they both sign extensions. Not a bad core to build around for years 2009-2015.

That is silly, in my opinion.

If that is the case then why hasn't he "clicked" with Loewen and demanded an extension.

Maybe you are right, maybe Bedard marched into AM's office and said "if you would only trade for another Canadian so I won't be lonely and can have a friend on the team".

Seriously, do you actually believe that ?

What makes players sign extensions is $$$$$$$.

It isn't like he is from the Congo or something. He is from English speaking Ontario. I doubt he feels like an ailen around here.

[WhoRU]

I am normally in the blow it up crowd but I think I would make an exception in this case. Bay is primed to bounce back with the injury issues he had last year and is still relatively young and underpaid. I would say there is a 75% chance he outperforms last years stats and if he does you are in a great situation. You can either trade him for a killing, sign him to an extension to be your cleanup hitter which we all have been dying for for years or ride out the contract and get the picks which could very well net us better players than Reimold and Cabrera. I understand 66's frustration but Bay is a guy who could really pay of now and in the future. If we could get him for that package then I don't see how we lose.

BTW Reimold as much as I like him does seem to be injury prone and have some holes in his swing.

[TyCobb]

That is silly, in my opinion.

If that is the case then why hasn't he "clicked" with Loewen and demanded an extension.

Maybe you are right, maybe Bedard marched into AM's office and said "if you would only trade for another Canadian so I won't be lonely and can have a friend on the team".

Seriously, do you actually believe that ?

What makes players sign extensions is $$$$$$$.

It isn't like he is from the Congo or something. He is from English speaking Ontario. I doubt he feels like an ailen around here.

French is Bedard's first language.

[66-70-83-??]

Considering that Bay has put up .900+ OPS 6 out of 7 years in the ML I would say much greater. A good year for Reimold would be Bay's poorest year, last year. At 29 recovering from an injury last season I wouldn't be to worried about Bay not bouncing back.

That is pretty impressive of Bay- putting up 900+ OPS in 6 out of 7 years, especially considering he has only played in MLB in parts of 5 seasons.

He only had a cup of coffee in 2003, 3/4 of a season in 2004, full seasons in 2005, 06, 07.

His first full seaon in the MLB was when he was 26 so he was somewhat of a late bloomer. He has hit better in MLB than when he was in the MiL. That is unusual. Also, his drop off was pretty significant.

I would still be interested if I was a contender. We aren't, so I am not.

[66-70-83-??]

French is Bedard's first language.

Regardless of whether that is true or not, what's your point ?

He speaks English, too.

Does Jason Bay speak French ?

Does Adam Loewen ?

[Goop]

Passing on a few things I was told my by guy today...

Lots of talk with the Pirates and there may well be a multi player deal here. Bay and Marte are two guys we've asked about.

He still thinks Tejada ends up with the Cubs. Doesn't think there's much of a chance a deal with NYY can be worked out.

Mora to Philly is a possibility. Looking at prospects in return.

Still can't find a trader for Hernandez.

FO is realy high on lower level pitching prospect. Wouldn't be surprised to see Penn, Liz and others traded this winter.

Free agent signings will be limited to pitching and backups.

Has not heard of any talks about free agents from Japan

Tried to drum up interest in Millar and Huff last week.

Not much expected to happen before the winter meetings.

Read as little or as much into this as you want.

Thanks for the update.

[El Gordo]

Regardless of whether that is true or not, what's your point ?

He speaks English, too.

Does Jason Bay speak French ?

Does Adam Loewen ?

Bedard didn't start speaking English until College. He probably does feel a bit alien, especially when you consider the cultural differences between French Canadians and English speaking Canadians, let alone Americans. Of course signing Bay has no bearing on Bedard extending or not. But preferring to play in Canada might.

[Elbren]

It is only NOVEMBER.

99% of the offseason moves have yet to be made.

If we want to trade Ramon, there will be takers for him. He is still a good catcher.

He came into ST with conditioning issues, he just had an injury plagued season, his bat seemed to deflate when he was healthy and a couple of our insiders have already said that there's little/no interest in Ramon.

Do I think we could trade Ramon right now if we wanted to? Of course. Would we get anything of even remote value for him. Not a chance.

I like Liz better.

But, I don't have a crystal ball.

That is why it is so IMPORTANT to pick a clear direction: either rebuild or contend.

You can't do both.

Because you never know which prospects will make it and which ones won't- we shouldn't be trying to guess.

Instead we should be stockpiling as many as possible to increase our chances of developing good players. Let the law of averages work in our favor.

Why not? Oakland has been doing this for years.

No.

I am not ready to give up on Reimold.

It's not about giving up Reimold. It's about trading his potential for a guy who you know will put up an .850 - .900 OPS and then either trading him for more prospects or keeping him until FA and taking the picks.

Either way:

- you end up with someone who fills an immediate need, both in the OF and in the middle of the lineup

- whether you trade him during this season, next offseason or just let him walk, you still end up with multiple prospects of probably equal value to Reimold.

What's better? Having Reimold now or having a Rowell, a Liz and a PTBNL in 8 - 12 months?

Yea i think i would.

I would bet on Bay bouncing back way before DCab.

I agree 100%. Cabrera hasn't showed much improvement in the past 4 years. If anything, it looks like he's regressed. After 4 seasons, he's basically still living off of that all too familiar tag of "potential". Meanwhile, Bay is young and a proven bat coming off of one bad/ok season.

[clarence]

Bay for DCab and Reimold seems like a good deal, but I will really worry about how we are going to replace the 200 innings that DCab pitched.

From everything that has been said by the front office, I think trading Penn and/or Liz is unlikely. I'm not sure I wouldn't rather see Olson moved than either of them. I think Liz could be very effective in the pen and I'm on the pro-Penn side. It isn't like appendicitis was his fault. I realize he missed a trip in spring training but that doesn't diminish the numbers he's put up at a young age throughout the minors. I just hope the front office doesn't mess with the young pitching.

[Boy Howdy]

Regardless of whether that is true or not, what's your point ?

He speaks English, too.

Does Jason Bay speak French ?

Does Adam Loewen ?

I think he's accusing Bedard of leading a French clique within the clubhouse.

[WhoRU]

It's not about giving up Reimold. It's about trading his potential for a guy who you know will put up an .850 - .900 OPS and then either trading him for more prospects or keeping him until FA and taking the picks.

Either way:

- you end up with someone who fills an immediate need, both in the OF and in the middle of the lineup

- whether you trade him during this season, next off season or just let him walk, you still end up with multiple prospects of probably equal value to Reimold.

What's better? Having Reimold now or having a Rowell, a Liz and a PTBNL in 8 - 12 months?

.

Well said!

If Bay returns to form then he would bring an enormous package and certainly more than Cabrera and Reimold. More like Rowell and Spoone but at AA or higher IMO.

[66-70-83-??]

He came into ST with conditioning issues, he just had an injury plagued season, his bat seemed to deflate when he was healthy and a couple of our insiders have already said that there's little/no interest in Ramon.

Do I think we could trade Ramon right now if we wanted to? Of course. Would we get anything of even remote value for him. Not a chance.

Why not? Oakland has been doing this for years.

It's not about giving up Reimold. It's about trading his potential for a guy who you know will put up an .850 - .900 OPS and then either trading him for more prospects or keeping him until FA and taking the picks.

Either way:

- you end up with someone who fills an immediate need, both in the OF and in the middle of the lineup

- whether you trade him during this season, next offseason or just let him walk, you still end up with multiple prospects of probably equal value to Reimold.

What's better? Having Reimold now or having a Rowell, a Liz and a PTBNL in 8 - 12 months?

I agree 100%. Cabrera hasn't showed much improvement in the past 4 years. If anything, it looks like he's regressed. After 4 seasons, he's basically still living off of that all too familiar tag of "potential". Meanwhile, Bay is young and a proven bat coming off of one bad/ok season.

But the Pittsburgh GM will trade Bay for him.

I am not willing to buy the assumption that Reimold and DCab = Bay.

Reimold's value isn't sky high right now either. He isn't coming off a monster season.

If that is the best offer for Bay- it makes me wonder what we are missing. Surely a contender will offer up a higher quality prospect.

What if it is Reimold and Loewen ? Do you still make the trade ?

A trade for Bay could continue the spinning of our wheels. Maybe he wants to hit FA and play in Toronto or Boston.

Do you insist on a contract extension ? Or are you concerned enough with the level of his dropoff to wait and see what kind of year he has in 08 ?

[davearm]

I'm having a hard time understanding why anyone who would like to see Roberts, Tejada, and/or Bedard traded away based on the principle that the O's won't be contending within the 2-year window before those guys reach free agency would want to trade away some of the O's own young players for Jason Bay, considering Bay is squarely in the same category as Roberts, Tejada, and Bedard.