A few things

[Dipper9]

Some of you are talking about giving up on Penn because he will never reach his potential. Are you serious? The guy is what, 22, 23 years old? His past two years have been derailed by appendicitis and an arm injury, and you are ready to give up on him? Kinda like we gave up on John Maine, isn't it? Penn needs to be given a chance to make the rotation, not traded for peanuts. I would do CaBBrera for Bay, but hold onto Penn.

[66-70-83-??]

Some of you are talking about giving up on Penn because he will never reach his potential. Are you serious? The guy is what, 22, 23 years old? His past two years have been derailed by appendicitis and an arm injury, and you are ready to give up on him? Kinda like we gave up on John Maine, isn't it? Penn needs to be given a chance to make the rotation, not traded for peanuts. I would do CaBBrera for Bay, but hold onto Penn.

But, Pittsburgh won't.

Nor will they do Reimold and Cabrera for Bay. That is a fantasy cooked up here.

It is ironic that some here will make up these proposals to acquire superstars of other teams with the Orioles only giving up players who are either struggling (Cabrera) or prospects who have stumbled (Reimold) yet at the same time get bent out of shape when davearm or others suggest a similar type package in return for Tejada or Bedard.

If Pitt is shopping Bay, I say at the minimum they will want two top prospects.

And speaking of Cabrera, he still has a chance to turn into a great pitcher. Who knows ? Randy Johnson didn't turn the corner until he was 29 yrs old.

[Frobby]

And speaking of Cabrera, he still has a chance to turn into a great pitcher. Who knows ? Randy Johnson didn't turn the corner until he was 29 yrs old.

Oh, please, not the Randy Johnson comparison again. Before he was 29, Johnson had racked up a sub-4.00 ERA 4 times in 5 seasons. His ERA was better then a the league average every season. Meanwhile, Cabrera has been worse than league average every year, and last year was his worst ever. Cabrera could still develop, but these Randy Johnson comparisons have got to stop.

[66-70-83-??]

Oh, please, not the Randy Johnson comparison again. Before he was 29, Johnson had racked up a sub-4.00 ERA 4 times in 5 seasons. His ERA was better then a the league average every season. Meanwhile, Cabrera has been worse than league average every year, and last year was his worst ever. Cabrera could still develop, but these Randy Johnson comparisons have got to stop.

And that was my point.

I don't think he will become Randy Johnson, either. I should have just wrote some pitchers develop later than others.

Sorry, I had no idea I would offend someone with using Johnson. He was the one who came to mind.

[Peace21]

Passing on a few things I was told my by guy today...

Lots of talk with the Pirates and there may well be a multi player deal here. Bay and Marte are two guys we've asked about.

He still thinks Tejada ends up with the Cubs. Doesn't think there's much of a chance a deal with NYY can be worked out.

Mora to Philly is a possibility. Looking at prospects in return.

Still can't find a trader for Hernandez.

FO is realy high on lower level pitching prospect. Wouldn't be surprised to see Penn, Liz and others traded this winter.

Free agent signings will be limited to pitching and backups.

Has not heard of any talks about free agents from Japan

Tried to drum up interest in Millar and Huff last week.

Not much expected to happen before the winter meetings.

Read as little or as much into this as you want.

Wow some good stuff in here. Thanks alot BB. Good to see your guy is still employed. Keep it coming. Im hearing the O's are working on an offer for Bedard. We shall see....

[Birds08]

Wow some good stuff in here. Thanks alot BB. Good to see your guy is still employed. Keep it coming. Im hearing the O's are working on an offer for Bedard. We shall see....

I feel they need to get the Bedard offer done ASAP, to find out where we stand with him one way or another. I feel like it will be good to have a read on that before deciding on other transactions.

[Frobby]

And that was my point.

I don't think he will become Randy Johnson, either. I should have just wrote some pitchers develop later than others.

Sorry, I had no idea I would offend someone with using Johnson. He was the one who came to mind.

Nah, you didn't offend me, so sorry if I overreacted. It's just that we've heard the Randy Johnson comparison a bit too often here. I think we both agree that Cabrera could still devleop into a very good pitcher. Let's hope Kranitz can do for him what Mazzone could not.

[davearm]

But, Pittsburgh won't.

Nor will they do Reimold and Cabrera for Bay. That is a fantasy cooked up here.

It is ironic that some here will make up these proposals to acquire superstars of other teams with the Orioles only giving up players who are either struggling (Cabrera) or prospects who have stumbled (Reimold) yet at the same time get bent out of shape when davearm or others suggest a similar type package in return for Tejada or Bedard.

If Pitt is shopping Bay, I say at the minimum they will want two top prospects.

And speaking of Cabrera, he still has a chance to turn into a great pitcher. Who knows ? Randy Johnson didn't turn the corner until he was 29 yrs old.

Thanks for saying that.

Whoever first floated the idea that Cabrera and Reimold could net Jason Bay did this thread a disservice, seeing as it's become as accepted as Pie ++ for Tejada. The former is dreamcasting, while the latter is merely unlikely.

[Peace21]

Passing on a few things I was told my by guy today...

Lots of talk with the Pirates and there may well be a multi player deal here. Bay and Marte are two guys we've asked about.

He still thinks Tejada ends up with the Cubs. Doesn't think there's much of a chance a deal with NYY can be worked out.

Mora to Philly is a possibility. Looking at prospects in return.

Still can't find a trader for Hernandez.FO is realy high on lower level pitching prospect. Wouldn't be surprised to see Penn, Liz and others traded this winter.

Free agent signings will be limited to pitching and backups.

Has not heard of any talks about free agents from Japan

Tried to drum up interest in Millar and Huff last week.

Not much expected to happen before the winter meetings.

Read as little or as much into this as you want.

Anybody else shocked (besides me) that nobody is interested in trading for Ramon?

[Fan4Life]

Anybody else shocked (besides me) that nobody is interested in trading for Ramon?

Unless $$$$ is the isssue... yes..

[PoorMike]

Thanks for saying that.

Whoever first floated the idea that Cabrera and Reimold could net Jason Bay did this thread a disservice, seeing as it's become as accepted as Pie ++ for Tejada. The former is dreamcasting, while the latter is merely unlikely.

The only reason why I think a Reimhold/Cabrera deal is unlikely is because Bay doesn't make as much as Tejada does so they don't have to be pressed to make a deal. If Bay made 13M then it would be more plausible. As it stands, Reimhold/Cab is a non starter because DCabs arb figure will cut into the savings of trading Bay. Besides, I'm sure they would get better offers than NR + DC.

[Mackus]

Anybody else shocked (besides me) that nobody is interested in trading for Ramon?

Not really. Catchers have a tendency of being very non-graceful decliners. Last year could have just been an injury-plagued down year for Ramon, or it could have been the start of his rapid descension to mediocrity or worse.

I'd much rather have a catcher coming off of a solid season than a guy who slipped, because moreso than any other position, there is a great risk he won't ever get back to that higher performance again.

[66-70-83-??]

Anybody else shocked (besides me) that nobody is interested in trading for Ramon?

I don't believe it.

It makes no sense. He is better than many team's starting catchers.

It is only November 12th.

Teams haven't finished writing their offseason plans let alone executing them.

[Fan4Life]

Not really. Catchers have a tendency of being very non-graceful decliners. Last year could have just been an injury-plagued down year for Ramon, or it could have been the start of his rapid descension to mediocrity or worse.

I'd much rather have a catcher coming off of a solid season than a guy who slipped, because moreso than any other position, there is a great risk he won't ever get back to that higher performance again.

This makes sense, but, taking money out of the picture, isn't Ramon still the best C available assuming Posada signs with the Yankees?

[Mackus]

Thanks for saying that.

Whoever first floated the idea that Cabrera and Reimold could net Jason Bay did this thread a disservice, seeing as it's become as accepted as Pie ++ for Tejada. The former is dreamcasting, while the latter is merely unlikely.

I agree that Reimold and Cabrera doesn't get Bay, but if you add in Liz, then it becomes a pretty strong offer. Other teams can certainly offer two better prospects than Reimold and Liz, but not many can also add in someone as intriguing as Cabrera. I personally don't think he'll ever put it together, but maybe there is someone in the Pittsburgh organization that does. If so, his relatvie trade value becomes much higher, and maybe a package with him and 2 very good prospects would be more enticing to the Pirates than another package for 2 very good to great prospects.

Maybe that wouldn't be the best package Pittsburgh could get, but it'd certainly be one worth considering.