Rasmus

[MikeAD]

Yeah I would. Rasmus by himself is not worth four players.

It would be a very bad deal for us.

I don't know, it would really only be three because we wouldn't have to bring in a third team to get Jackson. We have Guthrie. So it would be Guthrie, JJ, and a third guy. I can't really figure out a comp right now, but you might be able to add a lesser guy in there since the Cards would have Guthrie and JJ and not just rentals.

Rasmus, Jones, and Markakis in the outfield is better than having JJ and Guthrie in the rotation. If you then move Jones it could be a big jump forward. Some of the rumored packages for Beltran seem great, and I'm sure Jones would get more.

[Birds08]

I don't think Rasmus is the type of person this organization would deal 4 players for.

Clearly. As an organization we mostly prefer poor players with high character to good players with OK character. Rasmus is very young. Maybe his character is in question now, but wasn't Ray Lewis wanted for murder 10 years ago? People change. Their images change. Not getting Rasmus because of his character at this young age is completely laughable.

[Stotle]

SG -- I agree it's discouraging. Would you have done a similar 3 for 1 for Rasmus? Something like Guthrie, Koji, and JJ? Seems to me like that's pretty comparable to what Toronto gave up; I'm torn on whether I'd have done that or not.

That was my first thought, but service time considered I think you can go one of JJ/Koji and sub in a lesser relief arm. Maybe not. Depends on how STL views them.

[Sports Guy]

I agree. The sticking point for me would have been having to bring on Teahen, but if you are high on Rasmus you figure you'll be making that money back without issue.

I firmly believe BAL could have topped the offer by offering up Guthrie, one of JJ/Koji and another incidental piece.

I agree...Again, maybe the Cards prefer the picks they get with Jackson over Guthrie service timne...Or maybe they like that Jackson has been in the NL. Same with

Either way, I have little doubt that AM didn't even get involved in this and certainly wasn't willing to trade Guthrie AND one of the 2 relievers in a deal for him.

Wouldn't be shocked to see something happen with Upton to the Cards now...There was a story out there that if they traded Rasmus that they may then move on Upton.

[Stotle]

I don't know, it would really only be three because we wouldn't have to bring in a third team to get Jackson. We have Guthrie. So it would be Guthrie, JJ, and a third guy. I can't really figure out a comp right now, but you might be able to add a lesser guy in there since the Cards would have Guthrie and JJ and not just rentals.

Rasmus, Jones, and Markakis in the outfield is better than having JJ and Guthrie in the rotation. If you then move Jones it could be a big jump forward. Some of the rumored packages for Beltran seem great, and I'm sure Jones would get more.

Agree wholeheartedly with the post, and the bolded in particular. Plus, I know at least one NL team would give up a nice chunk for AJ.

[Sports Guy]

SG -- I agree it's discouraging. Would you have done a similar 3 for 1 for Rasmus? Something like Guthrie, Koji, and JJ? Seems to me like that's pretty comparable to what Toronto gave up; I'm torn on whether I'd have done that or not.

It would depend on what else I could get for Koji and JJ in another deal.

I would deal one of them, Guthrie and a lesser arm though...if nothing was happening with JJ and Koji than yes, I would make the deal.

[section36]

Yeah, pretty much my thought exactly. Our package wins the service-time battle; the real problem is that we have no other good relievers to sub in for either JJ or Koji. So the more I think about it, it's hard to do a 1 to 1 comparison here between the packages, in my opinion.

[Stotle]

Yeah, pretty much my thought exactly. Our package wins the service-time battle; the real problem is that we have no other good relievers to sub in for either JJ or Koji. So the more I think about it, it's hard to do a 1 to 1 comparison here between the packages, in my opinion.

Alfie Simon might be enough, considering the additional service time you get on Guthrie and either JJ/Koji.

[SilentJames]

SG -- I agree it's discouraging. Would you have done a similar 3 for 1 for Rasmus? Something like Guthrie, Koji, and JJ? Seems to me like that's pretty comparable to what Toronto gave up; I'm torn on whether I'd have done that or not.

I just think that those guys can get more back in the way of ML-ready minor league talent type guys, a first baseman, a second base prospect and arms arms arms.

Rasmus is a fine player, but guess what - I would rather hitch my wagon to Reimold in left nest year then blowing all our chips in one game of craps.

I don't think the Orioles are in a position to blow their entire trade season on one player.

That being said, if they DON'T do anything else and had a legitimate shot at Rasmus I will be upset.

[Stotle]

I just think that those guys can get more back in the way of ML-ready minor league talent type guys, a first baseman, a second base prospect and arms arms arms.

Rasmus is a fine player, but guess what - I would rather hitch my wagon to Reimold in left nest year then blowing all our chips in one game of craps.

I don't think the Orioles are in a position to blow their entire trade season on one player.

That being said, if they DON'T do anything else and had a legitimate shot at Rasmus I will be upset.

Guthrie and one of Koji/JJ shouldn't be the entirety of their trade chips (though I agree it probably is in Baltimore's mind).

Jones should be shopped, as well, and could bring back three or four useful pieces.

[SilentJames]

Guthrie and one of Koji/JJ shouldn't be the entirety of their trade chips (though I agree it probably is in Baltimore's mind).

Jones should be shopped, as well, and could bring back three or four useful pieces.

But Jones won't be shopped. Its not happening. Baseball is also a business and Jones is the best marketing chip the Orioles have right now, young talented and producing.

You can disagree with that all you want, but that is the reality of the situation. Yeah, trading Jones makes a lot of sense in the numbers-game but in reality Jones is too big a piece of this organization right now.

[section36]

Guthrie and one of Koji/JJ shouldn't be the entirety of their trade chips (though I agree it probably is in Baltimore's mind).

Jones should be shopped, as well, and could bring back three or four useful pieces.

Agreed. It's just a shame when it doesn't seem that Jones is being shopped at all. You'd be selling him at possibly an all-time-high right now, in my opinion. And with only 2 years left after this one, I'm not sure I want Jones tied up in a long-term deal. If it were me, he'd be my top trade chip right now, looking to get 3-4 young pieces back to help build the upper levels of the system.

[Sports Guy]

Guthrie and one of Koji/JJ shouldn't be the entirety of their trade chips (though I agree it probably is in Baltimore's mind).

Jones should be shopped, as well, and could bring back three or four useful pieces.

Exactly Nick.

You can trade those guys and get back the young, stud CFer who has more service time, is cheaper and is better.

Then, you flip Jones for several pieces. Its just another way of doing things.

What you end up with a cheaper payroll, more talent, potentially an ELITE talent and probably a better team.

[Stotle]

But Jones won't be shopped. Its not happening. Baseball is also a business and Jones is the best marketing chip the Orioles have right now, young talented and producing.

You can disagree with that all you want, but that is the reality of the situation. Yeah, trading Jones makes a lot of sense in the numbers-game but in reality Jones is too big a piece of this organization right now.

That's a fan's reasoning, and if a head of Baseball Operations is using that sort of logic to make decisions then the team is doomed.

There is no one interested in this team. Jones is likely gone when he is a FA, and the only way he isn't is likely if BAL gives him a non-team friendly deal which will further prevent them from gaining any payroll ground.

It's not "what I think". It is a fact. There is no reasonable mathematical way for Baltimore to build a winner, as the core is currently constructed, for under $90 million. Your reasoning is what landed Baltimore a $40 million deal for Roberts. How's that working out?

[Sports Guy]

But Jones won't be shopped. Its not happening. Baseball is also a business and Jones is the best marketing chip the Orioles have right now, young talented and producing.

You can disagree with that all you want, but that is the reality of the situation. Yeah, trading Jones makes a lot of sense in the numbers-game but in reality Jones is too big a piece of this organization right now.

I don't doubt that the Orioles believe this...But they are, of course, wrong, as usual.

But even if you take trading Jones out of the equation, adding a talent like Rasmus, who already has a 4 WAR season under his belt, is not something we should be passing up.