Peter Angelos...Good owner or Bad owner.

[raypetty]

You want to love PA, go ahead! Opinions are opinions. You can love him or hate him. I choose the later. Most of the posters on this board are always complaining about why didn't he sign this player or that player during FA. To me he's cheap and as long as he owns this team we will always be playing second fiddle to all the other owner who spend and try to better their team buy signing FA players who can help their teams while PA continues to be cheap and put money in HIS OWN pocket.

[Dipper9]

Exactly. The only way to beat PA and POSSIBLY get him to spend money is not buy season tickets and watch the games locally on TV. Maybe, just maybe he feels the pain and gets the message and begins to spend but I doubt it. Sorry but it's the truth. The last time he really spent on players outside of the organization was back in the late 80s and early early 90s.

Ah yes, the old "I'll stop entertaining MYSELF by stop watching the Orioles and THAT will get to Angelos" argument. Love it!

For the record, he is not a good owner, BUT, I would much rather have extended Kakes, Jones, Hardy, Wieters soon, BRob at the time, etc, then to spend ridiculous money on most of the "premiere" free agents that have been available over the past few years! But hey...that's not the sexy thing to do, so I guess he's the worst owner in sports!

[Enjoy Terror]

I noticed some posts, the one with the popcorn.gif especially, that anticipate this to be a controversial thread.

I'm confident that most Orioles fans agree that Angelos is not a good owner.

[Dipper9]

Bad owner who has finally made a couple of good decisions signing Buck and DD. I hope he has the sense to pay Buck and get him signed to a three year contract.

He has made numerous mentions of resigning Buck. Buck is the one who is not yet ready to sign.

[Brendan25]

You want to love PA, go ahead! Opinions are opinions. You can love him or hate him. I choose the later. Most of the posters on this board are always complaining about why didn't he sign this player or that player during FA. To me he's cheap and as long as he owns this team we will always be playing second fiddle to all the other owner who spend and try to better their team buy signing FA players who can help their teams while PA continues to be cheap and put money in HIS OWN pocket.

Who did the Giants sign last offseason?

[raypetty]

I guess we can check the results of the voting here and get the true answer. Yes, 90% are saying "NO".

[Dipper9]

You want to love PA, go ahead! Opinions are opinions. You can love him or hate him. I choose the later. Most of the posters on this board are always complaining about why didn't he sign this player or that player during FA. To me he's cheap and as long as he owns this team we will always be playing second fiddle to all the other owner who spend and try to better their team buy signing FA players who can help their teams while PA continues to be cheap and put money in HIS OWN pocket.

ALL the other owners = Washington, NY, Boston, LA, Angels, Detroit, and Rangers. I'm fairly sure the other teams are all around or under $100 million payrolls. Why do you think the only way to win is by signing overpriced free agents? Didn't the Orioles, A's, and the frigging World Champion Giants show you anything? This argument is old and played out. Peter is not a good owner, but its not because he refuses to overpay for "premium" free agents.

[DrungoHazewood]

To me Angelos' biggest failing is not in the FA market but player development. If we want to avoid what happened to us after 1997, we need to build a rich farm system. I'd much rather have that than the free agents.

To me his biggest failing is a complete lack of a strategic vision for the Baltimore Orioles. At least until Duquette there never seemed to be an overarching plan for what would make the franchise competitive, and even less of an effort to go in any particular direction. It wasn't even The Economizer model - the O's had a mid-range payroll most of the time, and signed most of their draft picks. But they never did anything.

[Dipper9]

I guess we can check the results of the voting here and get the true answer. Yes, 90% are saying "NO".

YES....because most of us agree he is a Bad owner. What he is NOT is the worst owner in sports, or the devil, or THE reason we lost for 14 years. And for you to say you "hate" the man because he is a bad owner, says more about you than I'd care to know.

[Palmoripken]

To me his biggest failing is a complete lack of a strategic vision for the Baltimore Orioles. At least until Duquette there never seemed to be an overarching plan for what would make the franchise competitive, and even less of an effort to go in any particular direction. It wasn't even The Economizer model - the O's had a mid-range payroll most of the time, and signed most of their draft picks. But they never did anything.

That's a good point too. One of the things I like about Duquette as opposed to his predecessors is he's creative and likes looking for the so called diamonds in the rough. Miguel Gonzalez, I'm looking at you.

[DrungoHazewood]

YES....because most of us agree he is a Bad owner. What he is NOT is the worst owner in sports, or the devil, or THE reason we lost for 14 years. And for you to say you "hate" the man because he is a bad owner, says more about you than I'd care to know.

I disagree with the bolded. He hired and fired the guys who made the decisions, and they made a ton of very bad decisions. He hired Syd Thrift, he fired Davey, he came up with the two-headed Flanagan/Beattie mess, he set the budgets, he hired the scouting directors. Peter Angelos is responsible for the 14 losing years.

[stomperspc]

To me his biggest failing is a complete lack of a strategic vision for the Baltimore Orioles. At least until Duquette there never seemed to be an overarching plan for what would make the franchise competitive, and even less of an effort to go in any particular direction. It wasn't even The Economizer model - the O's had a mid-range payroll most of the time, and signed most of their draft picks. But they never did anything.

Yep.

Peter Angelos is not a good owner, but "because he is cheap" is relatively far down the list. If at some point in the last 20 years, Angelos had clearly laid out the team's budget and constraints, while mapping out how to be successful within those constraints, it is almost certain that the organization would have been better off in the past and would be better off now. Instead, as Drungo says, there was no overall strategic vision. There was just a lot of meandering about and no real organizational model. A lot of that falls on the General Managers as well, but Angelos is ultimately responsible for them as the owner and the person that made those hires.

Most organizations can have enjoy relative success regardless of financial or other constraints as long as they recognize what those constraints are and develop a plan to work within them. The Orioles under Angelos' ownership have not done that and that is why they are in the position they are in. It is not necessarily because Angelos refuses to have a $120 million payroll or sign premier free agents.

[Tony-OH]

(Dip voted, now sits back and waits for the fireworks!)

I'm increasingly believing you are a relative of Angelos.

[Dipper9]

I disagree with the bolded. He hired and fired the guys who made the decisions, and they made a ton of very bad decisions. He hired Syd Thrift, he fired Davey, he came up with the two-headed Flanagan/Beattie mess, he set the budgets, he hired the scouting directors. Peter Angelos is responsible for the 14 losing years.

No disagreement here. He is the owner and is ultimately accountable for the poor results. But I bolded "THE" for a reason. There are numerous reasons why we have been losing for all these years, and while Angelos is one of the main reasons, he is not "the only" reason. Bad baseball people. Playing with the Yanks and Boston who had unlimited payrolls to sign THE best players in the game as well as extend their own players. Bad development of players. Etc etc.

[TonySoprano]

I disagree with the bolded. He hired and fired the guys who made the decisions, and they made a ton of very bad decisions. He hired Syd Thrift, he fired Davey, he came up with the two-headed Flanagan/Beattie mess, he set the budgets, he hired the scouting directors. Peter Angelos is responsible for the 14 losing years.