The BRob Effect

[MurphDogg]

It is/was a mistake for the O's to coddle BRob and give him preferrential treatment. He is 4 years removed from being a productive ML player. He should have spent a month at AAA proving he could still play. Instead he will spend a month in the majors proving he can't play.

I don't get your certainty here. Roberts hit .310/.365/.461 in Spring Training this year. Those numbers were better than Jones, Davis, Hardy, Machado, Markakis and Flaherty. I'm not saying that Spring Training stats mean much, but do they mean much less than AAA stats?

I trust the team's judgment and believe that should carry more weight than Roberts' stats when recovering from the concussion(s).

[Can_of_corn]

Of course he is, to show you how ridiculous the sample of games you are judging Roberts by is. Shockingly, you missed the point.

It took Flaherty months to crack a. 600 OPS.

Flaherty was at least providing value on defense at the time.

[MurphDogg]

Flaherty was at least providing value on defense at the time.

http://wapc.mlb.com/bal/play/?content_id=28532705&topic_id=8879234&c_id=bal

[Frobby]

Well I don't think it's that simple either.

Flaherty OPS over .800 in June and is the superior defender.

Casilla also had a strong June

BRob has done nothing in 4 years.

BRob will be 36 in October

Flaherty may have a future with the team.

It is/was a mistake for the O's to coddle BRob and give him preferrential treatment. He is 4 years removed from being a productive ML player. He should have spent a month at AAA proving he could still play. Instead he will spend a month in the majors proving he can't play. This must be very frustrating to all the players who can see up close just how badly BRobs skill have eroded.

How'd you like him not running out the ball he reached on by error last night??? BRob does nothing well and should not be on the roster.

First of all, I have no idea what you're talking about on the ball he reached on by error last night. It looked to me like he ran that out, and that's the reason the throw was hurried and off line. And frankly, I liked the fact that he hit a ball to the right side with runners on 1st and 2nd and nobody out. That was good baseball so far as I was concerned.

Second, I don't think Brian has been "coddled," but I do think that the Orioles rushed his return to the majors unnecessarily. I would have given him at last another 4-7 games in the minors after missing nearly 80 games, especially since, as you noted, Flaherty and Casilla actually hit a lot better in June than in April/May. That said, I still think there's a serious chance that BRob will outhit Flaherty/Casilla by a substantial margin, and very little chance that he'll drastically underperform the .620ish OPS those two have posted to date. So, I have no problem at all giving BRob the chance to play regularly for several weeks to see what he can do.

[Can_of_corn]

http://wapc.mlb.com/bal/play/?content_id=28532705&topic_id=8879234&c_id=bal

Yes, Brian made a play.

I remember Reynolds turning in a few web gems in his time at third. Doesn't mean he was the best option.

Do you honestly believe that Roberts is better defensively then Casilla or Flaherty?

[MurphDogg]

Yes, Brian made a play.

I remember Reynolds turning in a few web gems in his time at third. Doesn't mean he was the best option.

Do you honestly believe that Roberts is better defensively then Casilla or Flaherty?

When you are looking at defensive value over a 7 game sample, making a single play like that is a difference maker.

My instinct is that Roberts is probably not as good as Flaherty defensively. Roberts has always been around average defensively and conventional wisdom is that players lose a step in their mid 30's. Flaherty has looked to be a little better than average this year.

I think that over the 7 games Roberts has played at second base, he has provided about as much defensive value per game as Flaherty in his 58 games. Over the course of 162 games, Flaherty might be as much as a .5-1 wins more valuable than Roberts defensively. But Flaherty had a slightly negative dWAR last year, so it is tough to say.

It isn't fair to say that Roberts has provided less value on a per-game basis than Flaherty up to this point, and that is what I took from your statement. If that wasn't what you meant, then I apologize.

[Malike]

Flaherty was at least providing value on defense at the time.

0.4 dWAR, it's not like we're losing Machado or something.

[SeaBird]

He didn't promote himself. Take your complaints to Buck and the front office.

In a way he did promote himself. He decided when his rehab would end. He decided when he was ready to return to the club and the roster. Showalter said the job at 2B was his upon his return.

He went on rehab on June 22nd and was back in the Orioles lineup on July 2nd against the Yankees. During his rehab he took 13 AB's and got 3 hits.

And yes, he did say he was in a hurry to get back because he wasn't certain how much more time he had left.

Brian Roberts' recovery in 'homestretch'by Jeff Lippman | CBSSports.com

(6/10/2013) Orioles second baseman Brian Roberts (hamstring) joined teammates at Camden Yards in Baltimore Monday before a game against the Angels, MASNSports.com reports. He said it was great to be back in his home stadium.

"It's great to be back," Roberts said. "You feel kind of isolated on an island down there (in Sarasota, Fla.) It is already good to be around the guys and feel like you are part of the team."

Roberts hopes to go out on a rehab assignment in the minor leagues sometime soon. That said, there is still no timetable for that to begin.

"We are not looking to get any miracle solution out of this, it was just one of the things I brought up and they kind of agreed it was a good idea," Roberts said. "But nothing compares to being in this atmosphere. I don't know how much longer I have left to be in it, and I want to be around it as much as possible. I don't think we have a time frame, still at this point, but we are certainly in the homestretch."

[webbrick2010]

First of all, I have no idea what you're talking about on the ball he reached on by error last night. It looked to me like he ran that out, and that's the reason the throw was hurried and off line. And frankly, I liked the fact that he hit a ball to the right side with runners on 1st and 2nd and nobody out. That was good baseball so far as I was concerned.

Second, I don't think Brian has been "coddled," but I do think that the Orioles rushed his return to the majors unnecessarily. I would have given him at last another 4-7 games in the minors after missing nearly 80 games, especially since, as you noted, Flaherty and Casilla actually hit a lot better in June than in April/May. That said, I still think there's a serious chance that BRob will outhit Flaherty/Casilla by a substantial margin, and very little chance that he'll drastically underperform the .620ish OPS those two have posted to date. So, I have no problem at all giving BRob the chance to play regularly for several weeks to see what he can do.

"very little chance", seriously... I refer you to Tony's post and the fact that his combined OPS since 2011 is .555. Seems like a trend to me.

[CanadianOriole]

I don't think there's any doubt Flaherty is better than Brian Roberts at this stage of their respective careers. The quicker the Orioles go back to Flaherty starting at 2b and bench/release Roberts - the better the overall team they will put on the field. Given how tight the race the Orioles are in for a playoff spot is - I hope it doesn't take as long as I expect it will for the change to be made.

[Can_of_corn]

0.4 dWAR, it's not like we're losing Machado or something.

Some value is better then no value.

I would rather have 5 bucks in my wallet then 5 cents.

[El Gordo]

Roberts did something last night few O's have done all season. He put the ball in play to the right side with runners is scoring position and less than 2 outs. Good things can happen when you do this and good things did happen. Think of all the runs we would have scored if certain other players would deign to take such a modest approach.

[CA-ORIOLE]

First of all, I have no idea what you're talking about on the ball he reached on by error last night. It looked to me like he ran that out, and that's the reason the throw was hurried and off line. And frankly, I liked the fact that he hit a ball to the right side with runners on 1st and 2nd and nobody out. That was good baseball so far as I was concerned..

LOL, I just watched it again on MLBTV. Along with a good imagination, you must have worse vision problems than I do then. It is very clear. If you consider "running it out" a trot then fine. The fielder could have taken his sweet time and thrown Brob out pretty easily. It's only lucky that he hurried the throw because he sure didn't need to.

You guys wanna rationalize the lack of hustle on plays like that fine, but let's not insult people's intelligence.

[Malike]

Some value is better then no value.

I would rather have 5 bucks in my wallet then 5 cents.

If we're willing to give Flaherty 3 months to get to 0.4 dWAR, I'd give Roberts the same rope. He's likely to hit better than neg value, as well.

[Can_of_corn]

If we're willing to give Flaherty 3 months to get to 0.4 dWAR, I'd give Roberts the same rope. He's likely to hit better than neg value, as well.

I wasn't happy about Flaherty getting three months either! It was a bad idea then and it's a bad idea now.

Back when the burning question of the O's season was if they would get to 70 wins you could afford to let guys spend three months to find their way. Teams in the playoff hunt don't generally have that luxury.