Orioles "Appear to be the Leading team of interest" to Get Samardzija

[weams]

These things work themselves out. Right now? It would have to be Chen. But who knows? Figure it out later, just get some talent in here.

You must have a lefthanded starter in the AL East.

[weams]

Lee is on the DL. Flexor strain,the Phillies hope nothing major. I would not give up the farm for Lee either.

Flexor strain. Yeah.

[weams]

That would be terrifying if the guy in charge of running the baseball side of the organization has no faith in the ability of the organization to develop top five overall draft talents. Yikes!

Of course this is not the case.

[weams]

I bet a lot of people here 4 years ago wouldn't trade. Matusz , Arrieta , Britton , Hobgood how did that work out?

About the way that most pitchers, including guys who pitch for the Cubs and have a career first 50 games, does.

[weams]

I'll 2nd that trading that talent away for Samardzija DOES not make this a LOCK down play off team we've got other glaring holes.

Glaring holes.

[Ohfan67]

Plus, Kevin Brown used steroids to get as awesomely good as he was.

Like our LF'er/DH'er?

Just causing trouble.

[MrOrange82]

Striking out over a batter an inning is going to drive up pitch counts. Three walks per nine is not so bad considering he's limiting batters to fewer than 7 hits per 9 innings pitched. He isn't a frontline MLB starter yet, and he'll need to make adjustments when he's promoted. For some reason stories like Stephen Strasburg and Jose Fernandez have made adjustment periods look more like failure, and it's simply not the case (in my opinion).

Who do you consider a frontline starter, though, and what should be his timetable? Because it's not just Strasburg and Fernandez who fall into that group of "top" pitchers who've enjoyed early success in the big leagues.

This is not a comprehensive list since I just quickly scanned fangraphs for young(ish) pitchers, but King Felix, Julio Teheran, Kershaw, Greinke, Lester, Scherzer, Jose Quintana, Verlander, Price, Michael Wada, Sonny Gray, Madison Bumgarner, Yordano Ventura, and Chris Sale were all promoted to the big leagues at Gausman's age or younger, and they all succeeded almost from the jump. So what do the O's have in Gausman? A comparative project whose best years might not arrive until after the current core's competitive window is closing/closed, or is he a pitcher that the ML club can depend on...well, almost now (2015 at the absolute latest)?

EDIT: and I'm not asking to be combative. I just don't think we all have unrealistic expectations for "adjustment periods" when baseball's always been known as a game of adjustments. That really never ends. But from what I've seen from Gausman thus far, he doesn't look like someone who'll be ready to contribute to the O's success in a meaningful way anytime soon, and that makes me wonder whether and to what extent he's worth protecting.

[VeveJones007]

What trade wouldn't you do? There is no proposed trade mentioned?

Agree 100% on Gausman.

Getting Samardzija will take one of Gausman/Bundy. I'm not doing any deal for Samardzija-only that includes one of those guys as the main piece.

[Stotle]

Who do you consider a frontline starter, though, and what should be his timetable? Because it's not just Strasburg and Fernandez who fall into that group of "top" pitchers who've enjoyed early success in the big leagues.

This is not a comprehensive list since I just quickly scanned fangraphs for young(ish) pitchers, but King Felix, Julio Teheran, Kershaw, Greinke, Lester, Scherzer, Jose Quintana, Verlander, Price, Michael Wada, Sonny Gray, Madison Bumgarner, Yordano Ventura, and Chris Sale were all promoted to the big leagues at Gausman's age or younger, and they all succeeded almost from the jump. So what do the O's have in Gausman? A comparative project whose best years might not arrive until after the current core's competitive window is closing/closed, or is he a pitcher that the ML club can depend on...well, almost now (2015 at the absolute latest)?

EDIT: and I'm not asking to be combative. I just don't think we all have unrealistic expectations for "adjustment periods" when baseball's always been known as a game of adjustments. That really never ends. But from what I've seen from Gausman thus far, he doesn't look like someone who'll be ready to contribute to the O's success in a meaningful way anytime soon, and that makes me wonder whether and to what extent he's worth protecting.

Most of those names are high schoolers or international guys that benefitted from years in a developmental system. Gray and Price had three years of instruction at a highly touted college program at Vandy (Cubs poached the pitching coach) and the other college arms also had at least three years of college experience vs. Gausman's two years at LSU. It's just not common for an amateur arm to throw 100 innings of pro ball and then step into major league dominance.

Gray spent over 250 IP in the minors. I agree, Price was ready in very short order. He was also one of the most dominant collegiate arms in recent memory (right there with Strasburg from a performance/refinement standpoint).

I think he was rushed by Baltimore out of desperation for a playoff push last year. He should have spent more time at Double A, not to mention in Norfolk, before logging innings in Baltimore. His stuff is good enough to learn at the big league level, but it is going to delay the process. That's where we are right now.

When will he be readY? Depends on what we want. He's ready to be in a big league rotation right now, but it's likely not going to be in a front-end capacity. If Baltimore wanted a closer to fully baked product they should be treating this the way Tampa does, which would have meant significant time in Bowie last year refining all the areas that need to be addressed for him to fully utilize his stuff. Look at what Miami did with Heaney -- same idea, focusing on molding the game as opposed to rushing to major league contributions.

Is it worth protecting? If you want Baltimore to be a long term competitive team, then yes. If the org announces they are willing to run up to $140 MM in payroll I don't care who they trade.

EDIT -- not combatative at all. enjoy discussing, just have attention split between three things.

[weams]

Like our LF'er/DH'er?

Just causing trouble.

He won't make the Hall of Fame either.

[weams]

No, you don't. You must have good starters in the AL East.

You must have a lefthanded starter in the AL East. You must. Even a league average one. That can only throw 95 pitches.

[weams]

In free agency that can work. Much harder in the trade market imo.

Still, to do that just to raise the price for another team just seems like a waste of DD's limited time to me.

Conspiracy theories abound.

[CA-ORIOLE]

Is it worth protecting? If you want Baltimore to be a long term competitive team, then yes. If the org announces they are willing to run up to $140 MM in payroll I don't care who they trade.

I don't know about 140 mil, but it certainly looks like more willingness to pay. Our competitiveness (fringe and frustrating as it may be) and increased attendance is integral to that. Plus, it looks like we may have plenty of payroll flexibility post 2015 along with a few potential Q.O. draft picks. Maybe trades.

I know you don't like the perceived "fence straddling", but it is what it is for real world and justifiable reasons imo. I trust our GM to know the payroll limitations and not dump our farm system for Jeff Samardzija.

[weams]

Maybe trades.

I know you don't like the perceived "fence straddling", but it is what it is for real world and justifiable reasons imo. I trust our GM to know the payroll limitations and not dump our farm system for Jeff Samardzija.

The new hybrid team models appear to be all the rage. I'm with you on this.

[Stotle]

I don't know about 140 mil, but it certainly looks like more willingness to pay. Our competitiveness (fringe and frustrating as it may be) and increased attendance is integral to that. Plus, it looks like we may have plenty of payroll flexibility post 2015 along with a few potential Q.O. draft picks. Maybe trades.

I know you don't like the perceived "fence straddling", but it is what it is for real world and justifiable reasons imo. I trust our GM to know the payroll limitations and not dump our farm system for Jeff Samardzija.

I agree with the bolded. I think straddling the fence only works if you're willing to eat some money up front with the understanding that revenue is hopefully going to follow. It's a risky strategy, without question, and it means you may be tearing everything down in short order. There is definitely something to the idea that you need to keep momentum with the fan base, but Baltimore (in my opinion) is doing it in a clumsy way. This year they punted on the draft in exchange for the team CURRENTLY on the field, which we are now saying may need a big piece (in exchange for prospects) just to stay relevant in the playoff push. That's not leveraging opportunities, it's holding things together with chewing gum and toothpicks.

Anyway, it's all above my pay grade. Hopefully the FO is on the right track.