Trade Kim and replace him with Mancini

[Beef Supreme]

18 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

I was just saying I am a tad bit suspicious of Kirby's spike in power.  Same with someone like Steve Finley.

Have to be careful using comps from certain periods.

I don't disagree with you.

There is also the curious case of Roy White.

[Can_of_corn]

9 minutes ago, Beef Supreme said:

I don't disagree with you.

There is also the curious case of Roy White.

Yep, lots of guys.  I've always been surprised that Finley's name doesn't get mentioned more.  How many guys hit 26 HR combined over their first five seasons and end up with over 300? 2-3-8-5-8-11-10-30-28-14-34-35.  Seems a bit off to me, especially since he wasn't a super young guy when he debuted, his first 30 HR season was at age 31.

[OFFNY]

1 hour ago, Beef Supreme said:

o

I don't disagree with you.

There is also the curious case of Roy White.

o

o

 

Roy White had moderate power throughout his career.

The most that he ever hit was 22 home runs in 1970, and he hit 19, 10, and 18 over the next 3 seasons (1971-1973.) In 1974 when the Yankees moved to Shea Stadium, both he and Bobby Murcer's home runs dropped significantly, but they may have been partially because of the lack of a right-field home run porch that they hadin in the original Yankee Stadium, and that Shea Stadium overall was a pitcher's park for players batting from either side of the plate (White was a switch-hitter.)  Also, White played in less games that 1974 season (136, as opposed to 162 the previous season.) He then he 12, 14, and 14 home runs respectively over the next 3 season (1975 through 1977) before his playing time and his power lessened over his final 2 seasons in the Major Leagues (1978 and 1979.)

 

He hit 29 home runs in Japan the next season (1980), but that was in stadiums with shorter fences, and against pitching that was far less competitive than was the MLB pitching that he faced throughout his career prior to that.

 

o

[Dark Helmet]

33 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Yep, lots of guys.  I've always been surprised that Finley's name doesn't get mentioned more.  How many guys hit 26 HR combined over their first five seasons and end up with over 300? 2-3-8-5-8-11-10-30-28-14-34-35.  Seems a bit off to me, especially since he wasn't a super young guy when he debuted, his first 30 HR season was at age 31.

Bonds, McGuire, and Sosa were pretty big shadows to hide in.

[Dark Helmet]

13 minutes ago, Dark Helmet said:

Bonds, McGuire, and Sosa were pretty big shadows to hide in.

McGwire*

[FanSince88]

On 4/12/2017 at 9:15 PM, ChuckS said:

Kim and Smith are both FA's.  At least one of them won't be back.  That opens up an everyday spot for Mancini or Rickard if the prove to be deserving. 

There doesn't need to be a rush to degrade this year's team. 

This.  The logjam will start to clear after this season.  If Smith and/or Kim continue doing well offensively, they will probably become too expensive to bring both back.  If the opposite, we won't want them back.  Mancini can certainly replace Smith or Kim next year.  He's not a lefty, but so what, he's controllable.  

My guess would be to bring back Smith because he can play right or left and is probably better defensively than Kim while still having good OBP and decent power.  But no sense in trading Kim right now if we don't absolutely have to.  

In 2018, Smith platoons in right with Rickard or some other righty hitter, Mancini in left, and a defensive specialist OF comes off the bench in the late innings.  Or, we trade Trumbo during the offseason, and re-sign both Smith and Kim and make Kim our DH.  I actually like the latter move better.  

[DrungoHazewood]

23 hours ago, Beef Supreme said:

Mancini averaged 14.6 HRs per 500 ABs across all levels. His past two season he has hit 20+ across two levels in the minors -- a rate of 17.3 HR/500. And that includes Norfolk last year -- a ballpark that seems to suppress power and overall offensive production.

Kirby Puckett averaged 6.5 HR/500 in the minors. He went on to hit over 200 HRs in his career for a 14.3 HR/500 rate. That's more than double his minor league rate. Sometimes the power increases as players mature.

Not to belabor the "comparison," but Puckett walked at a Jones/Mancini rate in the majors just as he did in the minors. I don't expect Mancini's BB rate to improve but I think the HR rate will improve from his minors stats.

Puckett was a rather extreme outlier.  The vast majority players who don't walk and don't have power in the minors don't walk and don't have power in the majors.  Randy Johnson once had a minor league season where he walked 128 in 140 innings, but that doesn't imply that you go look for players with extreme control difficulties.

[DrungoHazewood]

2 hours ago, Beef Supreme said:

I don't disagree with you.

There is also the curious case of Roy White.

Roy White's power progression was unremarkable.  At 22 his ISO was about .120, and it peaked out in his late 20s below .200.

[Beef Supreme]

On 4/18/2017 at 4:51 PM, DrungoHazewood said:

Roy White's power progression was unremarkable.  At 22 his ISO was about .120, and it peaked out in his late 20s below .200.

Roy White's power surge is worthy of remark. It has been noted by others.

Thanks, OFFNY, for insight into what may have attributed to White's increased homerun power.

[sportsfan8703]

I may have been a little too harsh on Kim earlier in the thread. The guy is a great teammate. He's been barely playing but was hardcore rooting after the Ubaldo base hit. Seems like he does do all the little things, except defense. 

[sportsfan8703]

Looks like Kim will probably be sitting the next three games.  

Friday:  Pomeranz (L)

Saturday:  Wright (Knuckleballer) he might play here if Smith is still hurt.  

Sunday:  Ed Rod (L)

I think Mancini(RF)and Gentry(LF) start tonight vs. Pomeranz.  

[LA2]

3 hours ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Looks like Kim will probably be sitting the next three games.  

Friday:  Pomeranz (L)

Saturday:  Wright (Knuckleballer) he might play here if Smith is still hurt.  

Sunday:  Ed Rod (L)

I think Mancini(RF)and Gentry(LF) start tonight vs. Pomeranz.  

It will be telling if Gentry starts over Kim against Wright.

[ArtVanDelay]

59 minutes ago, dan-O said:

I miss Rickard. 

.....why?

He's terrible.  I can't believe people are actually convinced that he's anything more than a AAAA player.

[ArtVanDelay]

8 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

I'm not convinced one way or the other.   I'm leaning towards decent bench player but I always leave room for improvement.   Sometimes players actually improve over their first seasons in MLB.

A decent bench OFer should be good defensively.  At this point, all indications are that Rickard is very bad defensively.  Defense peaks young, how many outfielders get better defensively as they get into their late 20s?  SSS and all, yes.  We'll see where he stands at the end of this year with a larger sample and the new Statcast data (if he lasts the whole year in the big leagues).

[LA2]

1 hour ago, RZNJ said:

Wasn't it telling that Kim sat against the RHP on Tuesday?

It will be interesting if he gets no starts this series.

No, it was not telling at all. It was a non-DH game and Buck wanted to keep Smith and Trumbo in the lineup. Kim pinch-hit in the 9th.