How long does your blank check for Elias last?

[terphoopsfan]

2 hours ago, SteveA said:

Getting out in front and explaining won't matter to casual fans who don't pay attention to who is in the front office anyway.

Attendance will essentially track won/loss record, more or less, a year behind.   So if we are in for 3 or 4 more years or losing we are in for 4 or more years of declining attendance.   Obvoiusly there are other factors like promotions, pricing, etc., that can affect it, but the driving factor is going to on field performance.

Enron Park opened in 2000 and the Astros were contender-ish for the first 5 years there.   Attendance was:

3.0m, 2.9m, 2.5m, 2.4m, 2.3m, 2.8m, 3.0m, 3.0m, 2.8m  

Not sure why the dropoff in 2002-3 but basically between 2.8 and 3 million for most of the first 8 years.

Then a losing season was followed by 2.7m

Then a winning season was followed by 2.5m, then a losing season by 2.3m.   Another losing season was followed by 2.0m.

Then they started REALLY losing.  3 straight 100+ loss seasons were followed by 1.6m, 1.6m, 1.7m.

They improved to 70-92 and drew 2.1m.

They made the playoffs and improved to 2.3m the next year.   They contended the next year and improved to 2.4m the next year.

They won the world series in 2017 and just missed 3 million in 2018.   

Now of course Houston is one of the 5 biggest cities in the nation so our numbers will be lower.   But the general way that attendance generally tracks last year's W/L record is pretty much how it works.   We are signing up for an Astro style rebuild so that means we are going to see several down years in OPACY attendance that will be lower than any OPACY attendance numbers ever.

 

 

 

I'm not concerned about the casual mouthbreathing fan even though they should be. The reality is ownership has decimated a once proud franchise and when you own 17 out of 26 losing seasons you have no credibility. Fans are pissed and rightly so.

[MemorialStadKid]

Mr. Elias will not be the cause for the Orioles win-loss record in 2019. 

There's only a small group of people who should be held responsible for that. 

Any other conclusion is a waste of animus. 

MSK 

 

Edited November 19, 2018 by MemorialStadKid

[terphoopsfan]

Just now, MemorialStadKid said:

Mr. Elias will not be the cause for the Orioles win-loss record in 2019. 

There's only a small group of people who should be held responsible for that. 

Any other conclusion is a waste of animus. 

MSK 

 

MSK you can add '20 & '21, probably '22 also. We're so far behind the 8ball it's ridiculous. I will say we may not have superstars in the system right now but there's hopefully more than enough that fulfill rheir destiny as solid MLB players for us.

[MemorialStadKid]

Just now, terphoopsfan said:

MSK you can add '20 & '21, probably '22 also. We're so far behind the 8ball it's ridiculous. I will say we may not have superstars in the system right now but there's hopefully more than enough that fulfill rheir destiny as solid MLB players for us.

No doubt.

It's going to be a friggin nightmare. Between the Red Sox and Yankees showing no signs of slowing down and the Rays steadily improving (again), I don't see a window for Orioles contention for at least 4-6 years. At least. 

The one question that has never been answered to my satisfaction is how could owners of a MLB franchise ignore what other successful franchises have done for decades - and not only ignore - but do the EXACT OPPOSITE to the point where they have a historic losing season with no signs of a rebound for seasons to come? 

I cannot understand why the ownership has allowed the team to falter to this degree. 

Elias has NOTHING to do with that and should not be held to any kind of immediate scrutiny unless he makes the same types of decisions. 

MSK 

 

 

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, MemorialStadKid said:

No doubt.

It's going to be a friggin nightmare. Between the Red Sox and Yankees showing no signs of slowing down and the Rays steadily improving (again), I don't see a window for Orioles contention for at least 4-6 years. At least. 

The one question that has never been answered to my satisfaction is how could owners of a MLB franchise ignore what other successful franchises have done for decades - and not only ignore - but do the EXACT OPPOSITE to the point where they have a historic losing season with no signs of a rebound for seasons to come? 

I cannot understand why the ownership has allowed the team to falter to this degree. 

Elias has NOTHING to do with that and should not be held to any kind of immediate scrutiny unless he makes the same types of decisions. 

MSK 

 

 

They willing sacrificed the future in an attempt to win a ring before Peter died.

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, MemorialStadKid said:

No doubt.

It's going to be a friggin nightmare. Between the Red Sox and Yankees showing no signs of slowing down and the Rays steadily improving (again), I don't see a window for Orioles contention for at least 4-6 years. At least. 

The one question that has never been answered to my satisfaction is how could owners of a MLB franchise ignore what other successful franchises have done for decades - and not only ignore - but do the EXACT OPPOSITE to the point where they have a historic losing season with no signs of a rebound for seasons to come? 

I cannot understand why the ownership has allowed the team to falter to this degree. 

Elias has NOTHING to do with that and should not be held to any kind of immediate scrutiny unless he makes the same types of decisions. 

MSK 

 

 

The Blue Jays have a couple monster young bats on the horizon.

[Redskins Rick]

5 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

They willing sacrificed the future in an attempt to win a ring before Peter died.

If they had won one, would that have silenced some of the hatred here in OH?

I dont think anybody correctly foresaw the total collapse that occurred in 2018.

Give Elias 3 years to make his imprint on this team and then lets see where we are.

[Aglets]

10 minutes ago, MemorialStadKid said:

The one question that has never been answered to my satisfaction is how could owners of a MLB franchise ignore what other successful franchises have done for decades - and not only ignore - but do the EXACT OPPOSITE to the point where they have a historic losing season with no signs of a rebound for seasons to come? 

I cannot understand why the ownership has allowed the team to falter to this degree. 

Elias has NOTHING to do with that and should not be held to any kind of immediate scrutiny unless he makes the same types of decisions. 

MSK 

 

 

This isn't phrased correctly.  It's not that ownership "allowed the team" to falter.  Ownership directly interfered in the operation of the team to set up rules and roadblocks that were serious detriments to the team.  Peter was responsible for the Chris Davis contract.  He interfered in trades that would have helped the rebuilding effort sooner.  No doubt he was the reason for the lack of emphasis placed on international scouting.

Why?    Ego, pride...........a desire to 'win now' instead of later.  And don't underestimate good old fashioned ignorance.  This is the guy who hired Syd Thrift and made Brady Anderson the 3rd (2nd?) in command in charge of baseball operations..........because apparently he was nice to him.

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Redskins Rick said:

If they had won one, would that have silenced some of the hatred here in OH?

I dont think anybody correctly foresaw the total collapse that occurred in 2018.

Give Elias 3 years to make his imprint on this team and then lets see where we are.

Some of it?  Maybe, for a while at least.  Wouldn't have changed my opinion.

Yes no one saw 115 loses when a half dozen teams were already actively tanking.

[JR Oriole]

5 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

If they had won one, would that have silenced some of the hatred here in OH?

I dont think anybody correctly foresaw the total collapse that occurred in 2018.

Give Elias 3 years to make his imprint on this team and then lets see where we are.

It definitely would have silenced mine. 

But I am more than happy to sit through a few more seasons of awfulness if there is some hope on the horizon and an Astros-like path to contention is on the way. 

[weams]

10 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

If they had won one, would that have silenced some of the hatred here in OH?

I dont think anybody correctly foresaw the total collapse that occurred in 2018.

Give Elias 3 years to make his imprint on this team and then lets see where we are.

We were supposed to win in 2014. Manny. Wieters, Davis. They caused the failure. 

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, weams said:

We were supposed to win in 2014. Manny. Wieters, Davis. They caused the failure. 

Manny could have tried to play through the injury.

i don't blame him for his choice.

[weams]

5 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Manny could have tried to play through the injury.

i don't blame him for his choice.

I blame all three of them for the lost opportunity. I'll throw Zach in there as well. 

[terphoopsfan]

29 minutes ago, MemorialStadKid said:

No doubt.

It's going to be a friggin nightmare. Between the Red Sox and Yankees showing no signs of slowing down and the Rays steadily improving (again), I don't see a window for Orioles contention for at least 4-6 years. At least. 

The one question that has never been answered to my satisfaction is how could owners of a MLB franchise ignore what other successful franchises have done for decades - and not only ignore - but do the EXACT OPPOSITE to the point where they have a historic losing season with no signs of a rebound for seasons to come? 

I cannot understand why the ownership has allowed the team to falter to this degree. 

Elias has NOTHING to do with that and should not be held to any kind of immediate scrutiny unless he makes the same types of decisions. 

MSK 

 

 

I've mentioned this before but I think it all started when Pat Gillick was GM and we were floundering. He wanted to trade Bonilla and others at the deadline and Peter refused. We ended up making the playoffs and vindicated himself. I think he felt he was smarter than his baseball people after that. 

If you analyze some of the moves that have been made over the years they just make no sense. When they started having payrolls go up exponentially recently you had the question in the back of your mind "Is this sustainable?" Then to have DD make the comment of robbing Peter to pay Paul and finding out we're so far behind everyone else regarding analytics, international presence, scouting, etc.is unconsciable. If you can't afford to own a team and do the right thing for the community, then don't. 

I'm curious to know that when Peter Angelos finally passes, will ownership actually attempt to keep running the organization as Elias sees fit or are we going to be a franchise like the A's or Royals that are only competitive in small doses.

[Frobby]

12 minutes ago, weams said:

I blame all three of them for the lost opportunity. I'll throw Zach in there as well. 

First of all, we were not expected to win the AL East in 2014.   We played much better than the experts predicted, mainly due to Steve Pearce putting up a 6 WAR season out of nowhere, Cruz having a banner year, and just about the entire rotation outperforming expectations.   

Second, I don’t “blame” anyone for our loss in the playoffs.    The team played well all year despite the loss of Wieters in May, Manny in August, and Davis (who was having a lousy year hitting below .200) in September.    They beat a very good Tigers team in the ALDS, then ran into a very hot Royals team that was peaking at the right time and which had already beaten the team with the best record in the AL (the Angels) before they beat us.    That’s the way it goes.