Is Sisco Toast?

[Can_of_corn]

5 minutes ago, 24fps said:

I hope Chance gets it together beginning tomorrow because October through February is a very long time for smart guys lIke Elias and Sig to spend trying to figure out where to allocate resources.

Does anyone think that prior draft status has any bearing on future personnel decisions at this stage of the rebuild?  I sure don't.  I think Sisco's chances hinge on performance over the next month and whether he has a coach or two in his corner making the case that he deserves a little more investment.

I think he's making the minimum next year and hasn't been a trainwreck.

[thezeroes]

16 minutes ago, 24fps said:

Does anyone think that prior draft status has any bearing on future personnel decisions at this stage of the rebuild?

Draft Status is only or the amount of $$$$ that was invested initially in a player.  The higher the $$$ figure the longer a player is given to succeed. IMO

[Philip]

3 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

I've said it before but I guess I'll have to repeat myself.

If you think a second round pick that makes it to the majors was a waste of a pick you don't understand the MLB draft.

You want to see what a wasted draft pick looks like?

https://www.baseball-reference.com/register/player.fcgi?id=hart--001jos

You’re saying that because others were worse, Sisco wasn’t a bad pick. That’s poor logic. A player is bad if he fails. Making it to the major leagues is not success. It’s only a step towards success.

Sisco has not failed yet, but he looks like a failure. He may change positions and be adequate. Tony has suggested he might ok at Third. But at the moment, he doesn’t look like an adequate catcher at all.

The time hasn’t run out but the clock ticks.

[Philip]

33 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think he's making the minimum next year and hasn't been a trainwreck.

Depends on how you define train wreck.

[24fps]

7 minutes ago, thezeroes said:

Draft Status is only or the amount of $$$$ that was invested initially in a player.  The higher the $$$ figure the longer a player is given to succeed. IMO

Sisco is in no longer a rookie and his MLB OPS+ is 85.  Given his minor league credentials, that's not yet a death sentence, but it's not a ringing endorsement to stay on the fast track either.  The eye test is not a ringing endorsement either.   If Elias and Co. believe that high draft status is still meaningful after six years of professional experience to take into considertion then we all have been very wrong in being excited about his hiring.

[thezeroes]

2 minutes ago, Philip said:

Depends on how you define train wreck.

49 Games 141Plate Appearances 132 At Bats 7 Runs 23Hits 3 Doubles 0 RBI 7 Walks 28 K's.174 BA .216 OBP .197SLG .413 OPS

[thezeroes]

8 minutes ago, 24fps said:

Sisco is in no longer a rookie and his MLB OPS+ is 85.

Sisco was a High School draft pick.  If he had went to a 4 year college, he would have been draft eligible in 2016.  Question would be, how many of the catchers taken in the 2016 draft have out performed Chance Sisco????  Only Will Smith of the Dodgers is your answer.

[Can_of_corn]

21 minutes ago, Philip said:

Depends on how you define train wreck.

He's replacement level.  No definition of trainwreck qualifies.

[24fps]

Just now, thezeroes said:

Sisco was a High School draft pick.  If he had went to a 4 year college, he would have been draft eligible in 2016.  Question would be, how many of the catchers taken in the 2016 draft have out performed Chance Sisco????  Only Will Smith of the Dodgers is your answer.

I'm not saying I'm down on Chance Sisco.  I am saying that now is his time for him to make his case.  Not next year.  I hope he succeeds, but more than that I hope that the new FO doesn't feel the slightest obligation to respect decisions made by prior management groups if those decisions don't fit with current thinking.

[thezeroes]

4 minutes ago, 24fps said:

I'm not saying I'm down on Chance Sisco.  I am saying that now is his time for him to make his case.  Not next year.  I hope he succeeds, but more than that I hope that the new FO doesn't feel the slightest obligation to respect decisions made by prior management groups if those decisions don't fit with current thinking.

I can agree to that

[Philip]

1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

Big difference between being disappointed and calling it a wasted pick.

I said the jury was still out, but if things don’t get better, it can’t be called anything else.

[Philip]

10 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

He's replacement level.  No definition of trainwreck qualifies.

Well I’m not going to beat a dead horse, but when you’re drafted second round, you’re a top 100 Prospect, and much is expected of you, Being replacement level is… Well, not good.

And if he doesn’t get any better, and soon, I think calling it a wasted pick is entirely justified.

[Philip]

13 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

He's replacement level.  No definition of trainwreck qualifies.

 And at the moment his career WAR is -.1, So he’s actually below replacement level so, there’s that.

[Ruzious]

4 hours ago, Philip said:

 And at the moment his career WAR is -.1, So he’s actually below replacement level so, there’s that.

Which is where all-star catcher James McCann was when he was 24 - and actually better than McCann was at 25 - and about the same as all-star catcher JT Realmuto was at 24.  It takes more time for catchers to develop.  It's obviously too soon to talk about writing off Sisco, imo.  

[Ruzious]

In fact, McCann's career WAR was 0.0 coming into this season, and he's 29.