Where would we be without John Means?

[Bubble Buddy]

I know it's not this simple, but without Means, do we even eclipse last year's dismal record? We certainly didn't expect this type of production from him before the season. Perhaps Cashner isn't traded if Bundy was going to be the only one left that could make it through 5 innings.

I know our W/L is still terrible, but this guy has provided a lot of stability. Every time I check my MLB app and see that he's starting, I've come to expect that it will be a different type of game than the other 4.

What a great season. Cheers to you Mr. Means! 

[Moose Milligan]

Or, we can blame Means for not getting the first overall pick.  No doubt his rotation spot would have been taken by someone not nearly as good as him.

[panick]

Without Means the O's would have a much better chance at the top draft pick next year.

With a team that appears to need a couple of years to be good enough for a .500 record, I'd rather have the higher draft picks.

 

[waroriole]

If anyone tries to put him in a MASN commercial this winter, their head should be on a pike outside the warehouse. 

[Aristotelian]

3 minutes ago, panick said:

Without Means the O's would have a much better chance at the top draft pick next year.

With a team that appears to need a couple of years to be good enough for a .500 record, I'd rather have the higher draft picks.

 

Means is not a free agent until 2025. I would MUCH rather have a controlled MLB #2-3 +4 WAR starting pitcher plus the #2 or #3 pick than the #1 pick.

[Moose Milligan]

3 minutes ago, waroriole said:

If anyone tries to put him in a MASN commercial this winter, their head should be on a pike outside the warehouse. 

Yes, let's put him in a commercial for a tv station you're already watching and will continue to watch because your favorite team is broadcast on it. 

What a bunch of maroons.  

[waroriole]

4 minutes ago, panick said:

Without Means the O's would have a much better chance at the top draft pick next year.

With a team that appears to need a couple of years to be good enough for a .500 record, I'd rather have the higher draft picks.

 

Well that’s stupid. He’s a lot more valuable than the difference between 1 & 2. 

[Enjoy Terror]

Seems stupid to value a pick that might be a #3-#5 starter over a pick you’ve already developed into a #3-#5 starter.

[Just Regular]

Who is up to trade Rutschman for Witt and Brad Keller?

I will volunteer that in this desert of an 18-month stretch from the immediate implosion of Buck's last group to now, having 1-1 was probably the most enjoyable part of the bridge to next year's team when we can finally start to see more of our best stuff.  I am rooting for the Tigers daily now - Victor Reyes and Christin Stewart are charging them a little bit.

If some other team had 1-1 locked up, I wouldn't care much about the 2/3, 3/4, 4/5 difference, etc.  But talent being a bell curve, 1/2 is one I'm a little invested in.  That said - if there were a Strasburg or Harper out there, they'd be known by now, so 2020 may be a year the 1/2 delta resembles 2/3, 3/4 a bit more closely.

[Enjoy Terror]

6 minutes ago, OrioleDog said:

Who is up to trade Rutschman for Witt and Brad Keller?

I don’t think that’s as lopsided as you think it is.

[DrungoHazewood]

The literal response is that in games he starts the Orioles are 10-14.  In all other games they're 37-84 (*.306).  So if they played .306 ball all the time they'd be 44-101 instead of 47-98. So about three wins worse.

Coincidentally, the average of his fWAR and rWAR is about three wins or so.

[Oriole1940]

45 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Means is not a free agent until 2025. I would MUCH rather have a controlled MLB #2-3 +4 WAR starting pitcher plus the #2 or #3 pick than the #1 pick.

Amen.. A bird in the hand, no pun intended, is worth two in the bush.  

[Enjoy Terror]

15 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Coincidentally, the average of his fWAR and rWAR is about three wins or so.

 That’s by design rather than coincidence.

[DrungoHazewood]

32 minutes ago, Enjoy Terror said:

 That’s by design rather than coincidence.

Yes, the phrasing was for the WAR-skeptics.

[Just Regular]

1 hour ago, Enjoy Terror said:

I don’t think that’s as lopsided as you think it is.

It isn't the right fit for us now, and I wouldn't do it, but I wasn't implying it'd be extremely lopsided.  I'd just like to have a valid franchise player in 2 years, not 4, plus the Supporting Cast coalescing in our upper minors needs a cornerstone by then.

Regarding guys like Means and Keller, the burden of proof that they're good stays on them more than one season.  I'm thrilled with what we've seen this year of course, but he still isn't a Top 3 starter in the good 2022 team of my imagining.  Next year awaits the Ballard Horizon.