What a bunch of sad-sack losers

[JTrea81]

People expect too much and, frankly, I think management is more to blame than the players.

If management is going to send out Waters, Castro, Payton, we're just giving too much away right there. That's a re-tread SP and two awful hitters in a lineup of 9. You are going to lose 3 out of 10 times IMO.

I do not believe AM is doing all that is in his power to win games.

Exactly, Berken and Bergesen are just sitting at home right now, not even pitching the fall leagues. Wieters could have been up as well as other teams brought their prospects up. But MacPhail is too scared that Wieters will walk as soon as he can so he's going to delay his service clock. Reimold is also sitting at home.

MacPhail gave up on this team in July and he's going to have to do a whole lot this offseason to convince Oriole fans to watch this team again after another epic collapse.

[JTrea81]

This is exactly my point. And if it was just this year, I could accept it much better. But its not. Over the prior 6 years, this team played .470 ball over the first 122 games of every year, and .354 ball over the last 40 games. That is pathetic and by far the worst in all of baseball. And it's even worse this year. It is a disgrace.

So do you still agree with not promoting Bergesen, Berken, Wieters and Reimold? Because this is exactly what was going to happen by keeping that talent from this team. You can't have it both ways. We needed that talent to win, but by keeping that talent from the ML club, we've ensured a top 10 draft pick, and possibly a top 5...

You've got to admit, it's a little peculiar MacPhail basically abandoned this team in July. It's pretty obvious he wanted us to lose as much as possible...

[Frobby]

So do you still agree with not promoting Bergesen, Berken, Wieters and Reimold? Because this is exactly what was going to happen by keeping that talent from this team. You can't have it both ways. We needed that talent to win, but by keeping that talent from the ML club, we've ensured a top 10 draft pick, and possibly a top 5...

Sorry, but that's BS. Bergesen, Berken, Wieters and Reimold weren't on this team on August 17 when they were 60-63.

The idea that 4 guys from AA are going to be much help to the Orioles is laughable.

[longflyball]

And this is why the Orioles can't afford to blow everything up. They have to make a splash this offseason because everyone in the division is competitive except them. Otherwise they'll lose the entire fanbase. MacPhail is not going to be able to sell "stay the course" to this fanbase anymore...

MacPhail doesn't have to sell anything to the fanbase. MacPhail does what is necessary to build a championship ballclub, not what is necessary to placate the fanbase.

Constructing a team to "avoid losing the fanbase" is what created this disaster of an organization in the first place.

[JTrea81]

Sorry, but that's BS. Bergesen, Berken, Wieters and Reimold weren't on this team on August 17 when they were 60-63.

The idea that 4 guys from AA are going to be much help to the Orioles is laughable.

I don't think it's that laughable. Wieters and Reimold certainly would have helped the offense. And the whole reason the bullpen has been horrible is that the makeshift starting rotation collapsed in August. Berken and Bergesen might have helped out by eating some innings.

[JTrea81]

MacPhail doesn't have to sell anything to the fanbase. MacPhail does what is necessary to build a championship ballclub, not what is necessary to placate the fanbase.

Constructing a team to "avoid losing the fanbase" is what created this disaster of an organization in the first place.

If you don't appease the fanbase, you've got no revenue.

[Moose Milligan]

Go Frobby go!

Welcome to the Dark Side..... :vader::vader::vader::vader:

[longflyball]

If you don't appease the fanbase, you've got nobody to pay the salaries of the players.

The fanbase is not knowledgeable about baseball and is short sighted. If you attempt to placate fans, you'll end up making stupid and short sighted decisions. Which will result in more losing baseball and even fewer fans.

[JTrea81]

The fanbase is not knowledgeable about baseball and is short sighted. If you attempt to placate fans, you'll end up making stupid and short sighted decisions. Which will result in more losing baseball and even fewer fans.

We've had 11 seasons of losing baseball. At some point you have to start winning. The Orioles fan base will not tolerate another losing season IMO and when you've got so much money invested in your RSN and your team, you can't afford to lose like this.

The Orioles have the cash to spend this offseason, but if they don't spend the cash, they may not have it again due to declining attendance. The Orioles can't afford to lose anymore revenue, which they risk by continuing to trade away players and weaken the ML talent.

[Satyr3206]

I'm not MacPhail's best buddy or anything like it but from my observations he thinks things through from multiple perspectives and he definitely has a plan. It may take another year or so to see it make a difference at the ML level but it's coming. Just think about how different things were 1.5 years ago before he came along. Like I said before, all of the deadwood has to play out their contracts and then you'll see real progress. And there have been a fair amount of injuries to the pitching staff. I know it doesn't help now but better times are coming.

[longflyball]

We've had 11 seasons of losing baseball. At some point you have to start winning. The Orioles fan base will not tolerate another losing season IMO and when you've got so much money invested in your RSN and your team, you can't afford to lose like this.

The Orioles have the cash to spend this offseason, but if they don't spend the cash, they may not have it again due to declining attendance. The Orioles can't afford to lose anymore revenue, which they risk by continuing to trade away players and weaken the ML talent.

The Orioles fanbase doesn't have a choice. They're going to get another losing season, whether we go out and blow a bunch of money on free agents or not.

Again, throwing money at free agents with the goal of putting fans in the seats is what got us here in the first place.

[ccbird]

This is exactly my point. And if it was just this year, I could accept it much better. But its not. Over the prior 6 years, this team played .470 ball over the first 122 games of every year, and .354 ball over the last 40 games. That is pathetic and by far the worst in all of baseball. And it's even worse this year. It is a disgrace.

In a lot of ways there is no argument or excuse for what you are saying. And I want to make it clear that I'm not excusing the poor play of this team over the last 5 or 6 years in August and September.

With that said, two things pop up in my mind. The first is we have been playing in the toughest divison in baseball for awhile. A good chunk of our late season games are being played against good teams fighting for playoff spots. When it becomes crunch time in a pennant race the team fighting for something is not only the better team but really starting to dig down and focus inning by inning and pitch by pitch. That right there is a huge advantage. Then on the opposite end, as much as people talk about playing for pride it just isn't that easy. When your season is done by late July it simply takes the competitiveness out of you. You just aren't going to bring it every night like you would if you were in a race. You eventually become apathetic and play out the string. Sure, you still want to win and when you get a chance to win you'll give it your best effort but it 's a lot easier to pack it in and give up more quickly. It's just human nature when you have no drive and desire to give up sooner. I'm a diehard O's fan but I know I'm not putting in the time and effort to watch O's games in late Ausust and Semptember like I do earlier in the year. How can I expect the players to do the same. I know some will say that's there job but I consider it my duty as a diehard to follow this club and support them but I mail it in September as well.

[Keith SIO]

The whole rebuilding thing has always sounded like a bad plan to me. By the time we are winning we will have to fill even more spots with talent that we don't have and won't have. Our good players will want out and we will keep losing with a bunch of minor leaguers on the diamond who can't compete in the AL East division.

I am all for hoping to win sometime, but I like our chances better at giving a coach 2 years to try to get this team winning and if they can't, fire them. We are just keep losing games. People don't even go to OPACY for the Orioles they go for the enviornment or for celebrations of historic Orioles moments. Until the Orioles have a miracle and not only have a winning season, because it means absolutely nothing if we win and are in 5th place, then I will continue to be pessimistic. The team knows its problems and has done little to nothing to adjust during this whole entire season. The little adjustments they have made have been ineffective and cheap.

This whole rebuilding thing just seems like a way to say O's fans keep coming to the games, because in 2 years we'll be great. That is a gamble.

I was embarassed to have sunday season tickets this season. Worst Orioles memories ever. It feels like a chore to go see the orioles play on a sunday in august or september.

People were too quick to say phase one of rebuilding was a success early in the year. Everybody was raving about how different the Orioles were. They were never any different. Just hovered around 500 long enough for people to have hope.

[Intimidator301]

The Orioles fanbase doesn't have a choice. They're going to get another losing season, whether we go out and blow a bunch of money on free agents or not.

Again, throwing money at free agents with the goal of putting fans in the seats is what got us here in the first place.

Throwing money at free agents isn't what got the Orioles in trouble. Its WHO they threw the money at. Signing a guy like Tex or Dunn would add quality to the team AND please the fan base.

Throwing money at guys like Payton and Millar is like trying to sell the fans fools gold.

Trust me, even the most casual of fans weren't giddy of the prospect of going to see Jay Payton or Kevin Millar. If you want to sign FA's with the purpose of pleasing the fans, you have to get names that actually excite the fans...Tex, Dunn, Sabathia etc.

[Mooreisbetter27]

Guys I'm as frustrated as everyone here. This is getting ridiculous.

However, do any of you remember predictions from early on in the season? We were supposed to be over 100 losses. One of the worst teams to ever don a cap. All of us were saying it's a rebuilding year and we need to lose a lot because we're looking towards the future.

So... Suddenly the O's surprise us a little... they play way over their heads and people start thinking they're better then they are... that maybe we're not as dreadful as people thought we'd be. But let's get things straight here... we're not a great team. We're not even a good team. And we play in the AL East which is the hardest division in the league.

Take some consolation my friends... if we were in the NL East we'd probably be fighting for a playoff spot or at least a few games over 500. Stay the course. We wanted MacPhail to fix us, but it's not gonna be a sudden fix. Losing the MFY is hard every time... but they just have more talent then us... period.

One day guys... Maybe in 2 years... things will start to pan out. Just be patient my friends. And remember that in April... not even we thought we'd be any good.