What a bunch of sad-sack losers

[TinCup]

Frobby: might I suggest you just not watch this team in September? Makes things so much easier, better. September can be a great time to go to a movie, play some golf, watch a football game, see the Ryder Cup, go white water rafting...anything but watching the Orioles. The season ended a long time ago. Next thing that will peak my interest will be the draft, the hot stove league..

[TinCup]

For me... it ALL comes back..

to one....

Peter G. Angelos.

[Frobby]

In a lot of ways there is no argument or excuse for what you are saying. And I want to make it clear that I'm not excusing the poor play of this team over the last 5 or 6 years in August and September.

With that said, two things pop up in my mind. The first is we have been playing in the toughest divison in baseball for awhile. A good chunk of our late season games are being played against good teams fighting for playoff spots. When it becomes crunch time in a pennant race the team fighting for something is not only the better team but really starting to dig down and focus inning by inning and pitch by pitch. That right there is a huge advantage. Then on the opposite end, as much as people talk about playing for pride it just isn't that easy. When your season is done by late July it simply takes the competitiveness out of you. You just aren't going to bring it every night like you would if you were in a race. You eventually become apathetic and play out the string. Sure, you still want to win and when you get a chance to win you'll give it your best effort but it 's a lot easier to pack it in and give up more quickly. It's just human nature when you have no drive and desire to give up sooner. I'm a diehard O's fan but I know I'm not putting in the time and effort to watch O's games in late Ausust and Semptember like I do earlier in the year. How can I expect the players to do the same. I know some will say that's there job but I consider it my duty as a diehard to follow this club and support them but I mail it in September as well.

Here is why I don't buy it. Tampa has been playing in our division for the last six years, and until 2008 they have finsihed behind us ever year. They also play a year-end schedule that is largely against the other AL East teams.

Rays, 1st 122 games, 2002-07: 288-344, .393, 156 games below .500

Rays, final 40 games, 2002-07: 94-144, .393, 50 games below .500

Orioles, 1st 122 games, 2002-07: 344-388, .470, 44 games below .500

Orioles, final 40 games, 2002-07: 85-155, .354, 70 games below .500

The Rays from 2002-07 managed to play at the same level over the last 40 games that they did the rest of the season. Look at the Orioles by comparision.

And by the way, were not going to reach the lofty .354 mark over our last 40 games this year, unless we go 6-1 this week.

[Fan4Life]

I can't contain myself anymore. The disgraceful performance of this team in Yankee Stadium this weekend, and the pathetic display they have put on for the last five weeks (not to mention the pathetic performance in 6 of the last 7 years from mid-August on) just makes me nauseous.

Where the hell is the life and pride in this team? I'm embarassed to root for them.

When the pitching was getting shelled every day, frankly that was easier to take. But our offense has been maudlin this month. They really look like they can't wait for the season to end.

I had expected a lot more from this team. Remember all that talk about how resilient this group was earlier in the year? How resilient are they looking now?

There is no other team in baseballl that lays down every September like this. Not the Royals, not the Pirates, not the Nationals. Not one team.

So go ahead and tell yourselves that this is actually a good thing because we are getting a higher draft pick. In my opinion, it sucks.

Brace yourself because from what the conventional thinking around here generally is, our GM isn't going to be making any "real" changes this offseason so you can look forward to having this feeling probably for the next couple of years.

[Dipper9]

Brace yourself because from what the conventional thinking around here generally is, our GM isn't going to be making any "real" changes this offseason so you can look forward to having this feeling probably for the next couple of years.

This is the scary part. For all the wishing we do on here for Tex and Burnett and Bedard to return, to trade for a young shortstop, etc, the truth is not much if any of it will come into fruition. We are in for more losing for many more years to come.

[Boston Dave]

I think contending in 2013 is realistic.

This is a lousy organization, cursed by the worst owner in the game.Nobody good's going to play here if he has any wish of being on a contender.Quit talking about Texieras and Burnett's. It's not going to happen.The only way is to build through trades for young talent and thru the draft-and that takes time.

Mr. Angelos is not the worst owner in the game. What evidence to you have to make that assertion?

[TonySoprano]

Frobby: might I suggest you just not watch this team in September?

He did say before that he was going to turn off the TV.

This fanbase won't stand for 4-5 more years of losing and neither will our top talent.

I'd like to believe that, but 2/3 of the fanbase is still there eleven years into this mess. Every year, they come back for more, just like Kevin Bacon, bent over in his fruit-of-the-looms, waiting for Neidermeyer to give him another whack of the paddle in Animal House. Thank you Mr. Angelos, can I have another [losing season]?

In the winter, people get carpal tunnel refreshing their browser waiting for news of the big free agent signing that never comes. Come Spring, it's the trite cliche about "hope Springs eternal." By the allstar break, the losing direction of the team is obvious.

[Sports Guy]

The funny thing is if certain posters on this board posted this, they would be getting slammed...Welcome to OH double standard.

Of course, Frobby is right and it is a joke but the shocking thing is that people are surprised by it.

Every year we go through this and every year we hear that this year will be different.

Not sure what it is going to take for people to realize just how much turnover this team needs.

[Camden_yardbird]

The funny thing is if certain posters on this board posted this, they would be getting slammed...Welcome to OH double standard.

Of course, Frobby is right and it is a joke but the shocking thing is that people are surprised by it.

Every year we go through this and every year we hear that this year will be different.

Not sure what it is going to take for people to realize just how much turnover this team needs.

The difference is that when Frobby breaks down and shows his frustration it means the last line of patient established fans has now been broken by the Orioles perennial assault on suckage. The double standard exists because people recognize Frobby's level headedness.

I agree a lot of turnover is still needed. But I wonder why people are despairing so much. Everyone on this board knew going into the season that this was not a season about the team, and that the record didn't matter. Sure its rough that the team is playing horribly, but they have also been through a lot of injuries. For those citing the Reds as a team that is succeeding right now there is only one thing you have to look at. Harang, Volquez, Cueto, and Arroyo....all started the season in the rotation and all started last time through their rotation. When is the last time the Orioles have had that type of stability.

[osfan83]

They are still playing baseball?

My baseball season usually ends mid August.

This team has not started a rebuilding plan yet. Any team that starts Millar, Hernandez, Castro, Mora and Payton on a regular basis in August and September is not a rebuilding team.

This team will play better the last 40 games of the season when they really rebuild. Sign two TOP LINE free agents this off season..Tex and Sabbathia. Then bring your young talent up in June/July. Then you will see a team that plays above .500 the second half of the season.

[Satyr3206]

I find all this doom and gloom amusing. I went into the year expecting 100+ losses. I knew it would take 2-4 years to fix this organization. But I sure didn't expect this many people wanting immediate gratification.

The bottom line is that this organization is in much better shape since MacPhail got here. Let him do his job without the fanatical obsession of trying to contend next year and signing every type A free agent on the market.

It took a fair amount of time to dig this hole. It will take a few years to get out of it. But when the Orioles turn that corner the Franchise will be set for 5 to 10 years.

Personally I can't wait for next year. Wieters coming up, the pitchers having another year of development. A glut of pitchers coming back from injuries which means we will almost have to trade some of them. This offseason will be interesting.

[Three Run Homer]

- Frobby is absolutely right - this team is a debacle, it's a joke. Every single year they fold up their tents and go home with two months left. They have little talent and almost no depth, but they also have no fight. Would I do the same thing if I was on such an awful team? Maybe, but I'm not paid very well to play professional baseball from February through September.

- Anyone who thinks it should take until 2013 to build a winning team is not holding the front office or the players to nearly high enough a standard. If they really wanted to they could pull a Cubs, buy three or four top free agents and some depth and contend next year. Angelos and MacPhail just have to be willing to take risks.

I just don't think contending next year is realistic. They'd have to sign Tex, two frontline starting pitchers (and by "frontline" I don't mean Paul Byrd), at least one more respectable back-of-the-rotation starter (you can't contend if you have two guys pitching like this year's Garrett Olson and Radhames Liz in the rotation), and a shortstop to have any shot, and even then they have to hope that guys like Huff and Mora don't decline too much and pray that Sherrill, Ray and JJ will be healthy and effective for a full season.

I will say this: if we're going to sign any type A free agents this offseason, and give up a draft pick, then we should just go whole hog and roll the dice. No point in giving up draft picks unless we're actually trying to contend next season.

Personally, I still think we should hoard our draft picks for now, sign some type B starting pitchers to 1-2 year contracts to eat some innings to give Tillman, Arietta and Matusz time to develop, and wait to make a splash on the FA market until our young arms are ready to contribute, which could be as soon as next offseason.

[Satyr3206]

There are a lot of long term fans here so this is the question.

Do you want to go the old Oriole Way and develop most of our own players with certain FA's added to fill holes?

Or...

Do you want to go new Oriole Way and sign FA's that are in decline and lose draft picks in the process?

[osfan83]

I find all this doom and gloom amusing. I went into the year expecting 100+ losses. I knew it would take 2-4 years to fix this organization. But I sure didn't expect this many people wanting immediate gratification.

The bottom line is that this organization is in much better shape since MacPhail got here. Let him do his job without the fanatical obsession of trying to contend next year and signing every type A free agent on the market.

It took a fair amount of time to dig this hole. It will take a few years to get out of it. But when the Orioles turn that corner the Franchise will be set for 5 to 10 years.

Personally I can't wait for next year. Wieters coming up, the pitchers having another year of development. A glut of pitchers coming back from injuries which means we will almost have to trade some of them. This offseason will be interesting.

If the O's had played the first 3 months of the season at a .370 clip I think we all would have understood. The problem is this team has done nothing to improve.

McPhail has a year and a half under his belt and the major league club is no better than it was before he came on board. Trembley has a season and a half to instill his philosophies, and this team mails it in at the end of the season the same way it did before he got there.

If this team wins 72 games and plays under .400 ball the last 40 games next year, you really will have to question if McPhail/Trembley are any better than the last few sets of jokers to run this mess of an organization.

[Fan4Life]

I'd like to believe that, but 2/3 of the fanbase is still there eleven years into this mess. Every year, they come back for more, just like Kevin Bacon, bent over in his fruit-of-the-looms, waiting for Neidermeyer to give him another whack of the paddle in Animal House. Thank you Mr. Angelos, can I have another [losing season]?

It might prove interesting to see of the total fan base that attended the games this year, what % is actually rooting for the visiting team. And, how that compares to 10 years ago.