Tracking Ex Oriole Thread

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Il BuonO said:

Yeah, I’m not sure it was that good.

I was happy with my effort and in the end that is all that matters.

[DrungoHazewood]

9 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

At least I got some really good ranting in when it happened.  I was throwing down with everyone that day.

I think I was good with the deal because they needed an outfielder, Parra was playing well, and what are the odds that a Grade B- pitching prospect the O's developed turns out well?  Sure, he had a 2.83 ERA for Norfolk.  But that year everyone at Norfolk had a 2.83 (actually the team ERA was 3.17).  Mike Wright was 9-1,  2.22 with the same K/BB numbers as Davies' teammate.

Of course Parra made '89 Keith Moreland look okay, and whatta you know... the O's can develop a pitcher, at least if he doesn't actually have to play for them.

[webbrick2010]

Manny Machado's OPS of .753 is 16th among ML SS's and 17th among ML 3B.

He is 10th in Range Factor among 3B, and 23rd out of 24 among SS's

Of course at least he hustles

No doubt about it Hall of Famer <LOL>.

[sportsfan8703]

8 minutes ago, webbrick2010 said:

Manny Machado's OPS of .753 is 16th among ML SS's and 17th among ML 3B.

He is 10th in Range Factor among 3B, and 23rd out of 24 among SS's

Of course at least he hustles

No doubt about it Hall of Famer <LOL>.

He has some pretty crazy Home/Road splits.  Plus the Padres are over .500.  The hustling stuff to me is hilarious considering he has to run to first 600+ times a year on two knees with birth defects.  

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, webbrick2010 said:

Manny Machado's OPS of .753 is 16th among ML SS's and 17th among ML 3B.

He is 10th in Range Factor among 3B, and 23rd out of 24 among SS's

Of course at least he hustles

No doubt about it Hall of Famer <LOL>.

First of all, I’d say Manny is off to a somewhat disappointing start in San Diego.   He’s been in a slump the last 2+ weeks, and as is typical for you, that’s when you pop up to criticize him.    But, even adjusting for playing in San Diego, 102 OPS+ is disappointing.    

Defensively, range factor is a completely outdated statistic, essentially worthless and often completely misleading.    The advanced metrics show that Manny was playing very well at 3B (+19 Rtot/yr, +18 Rdrs/yr, +13.8 UZR/150).   He’s been below average at SS, where he’s been playing since Tatis got hurt.    

As to his hustle, that play on the grounder to 2B the other day was really embarrassing.   

Manny had occasional lapses in hustle with the Orioles, but in my opinion the lapses I’ve seen with the Dodgers and Padres have been more egregious than anything I saw with the Orioles.    Manny’s biggest flaw with us was occasionally not breaking hard out of the batter’s box when he thought he’d hit a home run, and looking silly when the ball hit the wall.    And yes, there were times when he didn’t bust it on grounders.    Just nothing as blatant as that grounder to 2B last week.   

[webbrick2010]

1 minute ago, Frobby said:

First of all, I’d say Manny is off to a somewhat disappointing start in San Diego.   He’s been in a slump the last 2+ weeks, and as is typical for you, that’s when you pop up to criticize him.    But, even adjusting for playing in San Diego, 102 OPS+ is disappointing.     

Defensively, range factor is a completely outdated statistic, essentially worthless and often completely misleading.    The advanced metrics show that Manny was playing very well at 3B (+19 Rtot/yr, +18 Rdrs/yr, +13.8 UZR/150).   He’s been below average at SS, where he’s been playing since Tatis got hurt.    

As to his hustle, that play on the grounder to 2B the other day was really embarrassing.   

Manny had occasional lapses in hustle with the Orioles, but in my opinion the lapses I’ve seen with the Dodgers and Padres have been more egregious than anything I saw with the Orioles.    Manny’s biggest flaw with us was occasionally not breaking hard out of the batter’s box when he thought he’d hit a home run, and looking silly when the ball hit the wall.    And yes, there were times when he didn’t bust it on grounders.    Just nothing as blatant as that grounder to 2B last week.   

Not saying he is not a good player, sometimes even very good, but just getting in a little dig at all the folks that like to talk HOF/generational talent for a guy that is not even top 5 at his position in the NL (current stats yes).

And if you think I'm cherry picking stats just take his entire 2017 season (.782, 108).

[Going Underground]

Manny has slumped over the last 15 days.One homer and five RBI'S. Mostly from the grand slam.Still has a .05 DWAR.Power is down somewhat ,may be because of Petco.Weird he only has 7 doubles.That is really low  for anyone.

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

1 hour ago, Going Underground said:

Manny has slumped over the last 15 days.One homer and five RBI'S. Mostly from the grand slam.Still has a .05 DWAR.Power is down somewhat ,may be because of Petco.Weird he only has 7 doubles.That is really low  for anyone.

If Manny played all road games his OPS would be .853, playing at Petco (.667 OPS) is killing his offensive numbers. I'd say overall he is doing well. Give Manny a year playing in Petco and he'll adjust his swing accordingly. Manny isn't likely to hit 40 home runs or bat .320 playing in San Diego, but he doesn't have to in order to live up to his contract. 

[DrungoHazewood]

2 hours ago, webbrick2010 said:

Not saying he is not a good player, sometimes even very good, but just getting in a little dig at all the folks that like to talk HOF/generational talent for a guy that is not even top 5 at his position in the NL (current stats yes).

And if you think I'm cherry picking stats just take his entire 2017 season (.782, 108).

Yes, you're very obviously cherry picking.  

[atomic]

2 hours ago, Going Underground said:

Manny has slumped over the last 15 days.One homer and five RBI'S. Mostly from the grand slam.Still has a .05 DWAR.Power is down somewhat ,may be because of Petco.Weird he only has 7 doubles.That is really low  for anyone.

While 0.5 DWAR from a corner outfielder or first baseman would be great it isn't good for a shortstop or third baseman.  Manny is a bad short stop and a good third baseman.  Average the two and you have a mediocre defensive player. 

[Ruzious]

Manny's a helluvan all-around player and was a credit to the O's, but I think it is fair to say he has under-achieved so far this season, but there's plenty of time for him to turn things around and have an all-star caliber season.  His OPS+ of 102 is the lowest of his career since he was 20 years old, and his occasional lacks in hustle can be demoralizing.  His defensive versatility is an enormous plus, but he's not the amazing defender he used to be.        

[Redskins Rick]

5 hours ago, Frobby said:

First of all, I’d say Manny is off to a somewhat disappointing start in San Diego.   He’s been in a slump the last 2+ weeks, and as is typical for you, that’s when you pop up to criticize him.    But, even adjusting for playing in San Diego, 102 OPS+ is disappointing.    

Defensively, range factor is a completely outdated statistic, essentially worthless and often completely misleading.    The advanced metrics show that Manny was playing very well at 3B (+19 Rtot/yr, +18 Rdrs/yr, +13.8 UZR/150).   He’s been below average at SS, where he’s been playing since Tatis got hurt.    

As to his hustle, that play on the grounder to 2B the other day was really embarrassing.   

Manny had occasional lapses in hustle with the Orioles, but in my opinion the lapses I’ve seen with the Dodgers and Padres have been more egregious than anything I saw with the Orioles.    Manny’s biggest flaw with us was occasionally not breaking hard out of the batter’s box when he thought he’d hit a home run, and looking silly when the ball hit the wall.    And yes, there were times when he didn’t bust it on grounders.    Just nothing as blatant as that grounder to 2B last week.   

I think it was the night before yesterday, when I was watching the highlights and Manny's grand salami!

[Redskins Rick]

2 minutes ago, Ruzious said:

Manny's a helluvan all-around player and was a credit to the O's, but I think it is fair to say he has under-achieved so far this season, but there's plenty of time for him to turn things around and have an all-star caliber season.  His OPS+ of 102 is the lowest of his career since he was 20 years old, and his occasional lacks in hustle can be demoralizing.  His defensive versatility is an enormous plus, but he's not the amazing defender he used to be.        

For me, Manny appears to be a fit inside the club house, and not a cancer, and his face isn't on TMZ every other day.

Is he perfect? Perfect

Yes, his lack of hustle is maddening to the fan.

But, the skill level that he can play defense, be sideways and have power to throw to first, and not even having a leg on the ground is mind blowing.

[Ohfan67]

3 hours ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Yes, you're very obviously cherry picking.  

You mean like when atomic ignored Manny's 2018 OPS+ of 145? Or the career 120?

[Ohfan67]

Although I was indirectly teasing Atomic above about disparaging Manny's performance, I actually think there's a high probability that Manny will not have a HOF level career performance. If you look at career WAR by age, then Manny is still in amazing company. But a lot of his WAR has been associated with stellar defense and his defense seems to have slipped a good bit at age 26. He is a very good hitter, but he is very unlikely to hit his way into the HOF (he's currently tied for 372nd in career OPS+, for example). It was very reasonable to project Manny as a HOF'er several years ago based on WAR by age comparisons, but a significant part of Manny's worth by year is likely to pretty much evaporate in the next few years. Not ragging on Manny, but just thinking out loud about the relative value of his defense and its direction. Plus he is unlikely to get a lot of feel good votes from writers unless his "brand" changes a lot in the future.