“Orioles big game shopping & most believe it's exclusively rotation”

[Sports Guy]

21 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Perhaps, but if the teams win a World Series within that time frame, they are not going to be too concerned about the down years when these players will not be earning that money most likely.

Whether we like it or not, these teams have done the financial math and these signing work for them. The question we should have is why are similar market teams able to do some of these deals with the Orioles sit on the sidelines twiddling thumbs?

I think we know why.

I think we should be asking, why are Tampa, Atlanta and  Houston, arguably the 3 best well run organizations in the sport, able to compete and go deep into the playoffs without playing this game?

Thats what matters to me. You don’t need to do this to win. That’s obvious. It’s proven. It’s also proven that these deals largely blow up in the faces of the teams who sign them.

How many of the 8+ year, 9 figure FA deals have resulted in titles for their teams?

Edited December 14, 2022 by Sports Guy

[Sports Guy]

https://legacy.baseballprospectus.com/compensation/cots/league-info/highest-paid-players/
 

A list of all the 9 figure deals in MLB history, some of which were not FA deals. How many teams won a title in the free agency years of these contracts?

[tabletop]

11 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I think we should be asking, why are Tampa, Atlanta and  Houston, arguably the 3 best well run organizations in the sport, able to compete and go deep into the playoffs without playing this game?

Thats what matters to me. You don’t need to do this to win. That’s obvious. It’s proven. It’s also proven that these deals largely blow up in the faces of the teams who sign them.

How many of the 8+ year, 9 figure FA deals have resulted in titles for their teams?

While true they don’t do mega deals those teams all extend their own, trade for good proven major leaguers. and sign free agents to multi year deals. It’s still early in the grand scheme of things but so far Elias hasn’t done any.

Edited December 14, 2022 by tabletop

[Sports Guy]

1 minute ago, tabletop said:

While true they don’t do mega deals those teams all extend their own, trade for good proven major leaguers. and sign free agents to multi year deals. It’s still early in the grand scheme of things but so far Elias hasn’t done any.

I’m aware. I have mentioned this many times. This is about signing the big time free agents. 

[tabletop]

Just now, Sports Guy said:

I’m aware. I have mentioned this many times. This is about signing the big time free agents. 

Just saying, that’s where all the angst is from. I agree with you on the mega deals front.

[Sports Guy]

21 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

https://legacy.baseballprospectus.com/compensation/cots/league-info/highest-paid-players/
 

A list of all the 9 figure deals in MLB history, some of which were not FA deals. How many teams won a title in the free agency years of these contracts?

Red Sox: 2 titles with the Manny deal.

Yankees: 1 title with AROD, Tex, CC and Jeter

Boston: 1 title with Price, Martinez and Pedroia

Dodgers: 1 title with Dodgers (asterisk title)

Nats: 1 title with Scherzer, Corbin, Strasburg and Zimmerman

Cubs: 1 title with Heyward And Lester.

Giants: 2 with Cain extension 

 

Pujols, Posey and Acuna won but they would have been under contract anyway.

Bregman and Altuve just won but they were extensions, not FA signings.

Did I miss anyone?

 

Edited December 15, 2022 by Sports Guy

[Sports Guy]

7 minutes ago, tabletop said:

Just saying, that’s where all the angst is from. I agree with you on the mega deals front.

But that angst is misplaced until we know what they have done. No one is being traded yet.

[eddie83]

8 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Red Sox: 2 titles with the Manny deal.

Yankees: 1 title with AROD and Jeter

Boston: 1 title with Price and Pedroia

Dodgers: 1 title with Dodgers (asterisk title)

Nats: 1 title with Scherzer, Strasburg and Zimmerman

Cubs: 1 title with Heyward.

 

Pujols, Posey and Acuna won but they would have been under contract anyway.

Bregman and Altuve just won but they were extensions, not FA signings.

Did I miss anyone?

 

CC 2009 Yanks. 

[eddie83]

Strasburg also had to have had an opt out after 19 on that first big deal. Then he signed the second one. 

[Tony-OH]

32 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I think we should be asking, why are Tampa, Atlanta and  Houston, arguably the 3 best well run organizations in the sport, able to compete and go deep into the playoffs without playing this game?

Thats what matters to me. You don’t need to do this to win. That’s obvious. It’s proven. It’s also proven that these deals largely blow up in the faces of the teams who sign them.

How many of the 8+ year, 9 figure FA deals have resulted in titles for their teams?

BTW, just to be on record, I don't like these kinds of deals either, but what I realize is it doesn't matter what I like, it's what the market bears.

At some point, the Orioles need to take a calculated risk on a high impact player, most likely a starting pitcher unless Elias can become a shrewd trader of prospects.

None of these contracts so far were for players the Orioles should in on anyways, and besides Rodon, who I know you don't like, there's not an impact starting pitcher available anymore vis FA. 

So that means they are going to need Grayson to be pretty darn good, pretty darn quickly and hope that Hall can take that next step as a starter next year while also hoping Means comes back and is who is was before the injury.

That's a lot of ifs for me.

Now of course there is trading and I think that market will start in January. With the Orioles infield depth, they should be able to get a quality starter, but it won't be a TOR without moving Gunnar, Adley or Holliday.

 

[geschinger]

53 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Perhaps, but if the teams win a World Series within that time frame, they are not going to be too concerned about the down years when these players will not be earning that money most likely.

Whether we like it or not, these teams have done the financial math and these signing work for them. The question we should have is why are similar market teams able to do some of these deals with the Orioles sit on the sidelines twiddling thumbs?

I think we know why.

A more cynical take is the GMs driving these moves are willing to take on contracts that have an extremly low probability of working out with the understanding that if they don't win in the short run they won't be around anyway.  It won't be them having to deal with the mess they created during the last 2/3 of these deals.

[eddie83]

Cain extension with SFG. 2 more rings. Second one he did not contribute much. 
 

JD Martinez Boston. Corbin Nats.  Lester Cubs.  

[eddie83]

Cain I am not positive if he went to FA or not. Was close. Obviously stayed on same team. Holliday STL. Zito SF.  
 

Zito 2 WS.  

Edited December 14, 2022 by eddie83

[Just Regular]

4 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

Strasburg also had to have had an opt out after 19 on that first big deal. Then he signed the second one. 

Strasburg's baseball life has been an interesting one...that Flag that will Fly Forever is in great part due to him, but he and Corbin used a lot of themselves up that month.    By October 2019, Scherzer was already hiking down Mt. Greatness, growling as loud as ever but clearly past peak to my eye.     He's competitive enough to burn to dominate ordinary teams to keep his regular season stats brilliant, but probably isn't keeping up with a scientifically rested Cristian Javier these days.    I'm curious to see how much Buck can LeBron handle his guys these next couple years.

Would folks sign up in blood for Grayson to have the same ~15 years of results with us Strasburg is about three-quarters of the way through now with us?

[maybenxtyr]

10 minutes ago, geschinger said:

A more cynical take is the GMs driving these moves are willing to take on contracts that have an extremly low probability of working out with the understanding that if they don't win in the short run they won't be around anyway.  It won't be them having to deal with the mess they created during the last 2/3 of these deals.

That is 100% correct. 

 

I think most of the mega deals are terrible but I don't fault GM's for taking their shots according to their budgets. That being said, CC will probably see at least 2 other GM's during that contract.