Gunnar Henderson 2023

[banks703]

Since Frobby and I were discussing his pitch selection the other day Gunnar seems to have increased his aggressiveness earlier in the count, which I think is a good approach for him right now. 
 

He will be fine. He’s 8-48 right now batting .166. 
 

If some of those ABs with hard contact that resulted in an out had turned out different, we wouldn’t be having this convo. Let’s say he has four more hits right now. He’d be hitting .250. Five more and he’s hitting .270 and we’re only debating his defense. 
 

it’s April. He’s 21. 

[DirtyBird]

1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

It might help him, might hurt him.  Probably won't make much of a difference in the grand scheme of his career.

I'm pretty much always in favor of challenging players.  Just like I didn't want Grayson sent to the minors to start the season.

Maybe Gunnar can't overcome his swing and miss issues.  Maybe he can't hit lefties and ends up a platoon guy.

I don't know.  But if those things are true I don't think sending him down to Norfolk for a month is going to change it.

At what point do you make winning games the priority and figuring out Gunnar secondary?

[wildcard]

19 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

 

How did he finish last season at the plate? How was he in sprint training? How has he done so far this season?

What is better roster/organization construction?

Frazier, Urias, Mateo as full time regulars and Westburg as a utility guy that fills in on off days. Henderson in AAA working things out at the plate and field, building his confidence back?

or

The current product of bouncing a struggling Henderson between 3B and SS and forcing him into the lineup most nights over players who are offering better production?

What makes you think Westburg will do better than Gunnar?   Prospects sometimes go through an adjustment period.  Cal did.   They have to learn the league.  Learn how to use their strengths.

We are going to see this with some of the prospects that are in the minors as the reach the majors.   But Elias has set this up to keep the team young with prospect graduating.   I think we have to get used to it.

[spleen1015]

3 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

At what point do you make winning games the priority and figuring out Gunnar secondary?

Why can't both be a priority? Looks like they have been and it's worked out ok. Gunnar is not costing us games, so....

[wildcard]

4 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

At what point do you make winning games the priority and figuring out Gunnar secondary?

The team is winning.

[DirtyBird]

3 minutes ago, banks703 said:

Since Frobby and I were discussing his pitch selection the other day Gunnar seems to have increased his aggressiveness earlier in the count, which I think is a good approach for him right now. 
 

He will be fine. He’s 8-48 right now batting .166. 
 

If some of those ABs with hard contact that resulted in an out had turned out different, we wouldn’t be having this convo. Let’s say he has four more hits right now. He’d be hitting .250. Five more and he’s hitting .270 and we’re only debating his defense. 
 

it’s April. He’s 21. 

He finished 2022 6-42, and was 8-37 in spring training, and now 8-48

[RZNJ]

1 minute ago, DirtyBird said:

He finished 2022 6-42, and was 8-37 in spring training, and now 8-48

So you don’t think he’s going to hit?

[DirtyBird]

1 minute ago, wildcard said:

What makes you think Westburg will do better than Gunnar?  

Westburg would not be forced into the lineup every night. Westburg would not be forcing Urias to play 2B, or Mateo to the bench.

[Tony-OH]

On 4/17/2023 at 9:50 AM, Jagwar said:

I love that he's struggling at the plate, yet he's on base 1-2 times a game and has scored 12 runs. 

Even if he hits .250-260 he's going to be a dangerous productive part of the lineup 

This is really the biggest part to his game that will help his value as a player long term. Unlike Mountcastle and even Hays when he's in a funk, they don't walk enough when they are struggling and they end up out machines. While Gunnar's start has been slow, and his inability to hit offspeed this year is a bit of a concern, he's getting on base and his WOBA and XWOBA that Frobby pointed out is a good indicator that he can bring some value to the lineup even when he's not hitting for average or power.

He's going to be fine long-term and considering the Orioles are 10-7 with his struggling a bit, it makes me feel good that once he gets hot he could be a real monster at the plate.

[Sports Guy]

1 hour ago, DirtyBird said:

 

How did he finish last season at the plate? How was he in sprint training? How has he done so far this season?

What is better roster/organization construction?

Frazier, Urias, Mateo as full time regulars and Westburg as a utility guy that fills in on off days. Henderson in AAA working things out at the plate and field, building his confidence back?

or

The current product of bouncing a struggling Henderson between 3B and SS and forcing him into the lineup most nights over players who are offering better production?

You mean the Adam Frazier who is back to a sub 700 OPS, is 4 for his last 31 and who saw most of his positive production occur in the first 3 games of the year?

No, he’s not part of any rotation that is better. 

[Frobby]

Gunnar seems confused and overthinking things at the plate right now.  To me, his timing has been off all season.  I’ve seen him miss or foul off numerous pitches that he would have crushed last year.  I think it’s the right move to let him ride it out, playing most days and getting the occasional day off to clear his head if he continues to struggle.  I still believe he will figure it out, but his body language and facial expressions tell me that this slump is really weighing on him.  His plate discipline is great, but he’s got to hit the hittable pitches.  

[Tony-OH]

1 hour ago, DirtyBird said:

 

How did he finish last season at the plate? How was he in sprint training? How has he done so far this season?

What is better roster/organization construction?

Frazier, Urias, Mateo as full time regulars and Westburg as a utility guy that fills in on off days. Henderson in AAA working things out at the plate and field, building his confidence back?

or

The current product of bouncing a struggling Henderson between 3B and SS and forcing him into the lineup most nights over players who are offering better production?

So far the Orioles are 10-7 while Henderson goes through these struggles so I'm ok with being patient. 

The good news offensively is he's hitting fastballs just fine putting up a .452 (elite) WOBA against them. The bad news is he hasn't gotten a hit this season of anything but fastballs going 0-for-23 with 14 Ks. Another thing of concern is his two strike approach so far this season. He's 0-for-26 with 22 Ks with two strikes. 

So those are concerning numbers to some extent since a hitter can't be successful long-term with the inability to hit offspeed. Henderson has been able to be somewhat productive because of his ability to hit those fastballs and his eye at the plate that allows him to lay off the junk. 

The one thing I think Gunnar needs to go back to trying to hit the other way for awhile. They've been getting him down and in especially with two strikes, but they've been getting ahead of him pitching him away a lot and he hasn't been able to make them pay often by taking that outside pitch to left field.

Either way, while he does have some concerning stats against non-fastballs and with two strikes, his ability to get on base has allowed him to bring some value even during these struggles.

Saying all that, I think he gets until Mid-May to correct this stuff before the Orioles will potentially do anything, and only then if the Orioles are scuffling. I still have confidence he can make the adjustments.

[Tony-OH]

Just now, Frobby said:

 but his body language and facial expressions tell me that this slump is really weighing on him.  

Gunnar has always been an emotional guy at the plate. He was definitely one of the few players that would be visibly get upset after bad at bats in the minors and frequently would jaw with umpires in what he perceived as bad calls (some of which were not). 

I agree with you that his frustrations are getting more and more noticeable after the strike outs. I think the Orioles are going to keep running him out there unless he spirals really badly. 

Right now, he's in his own head both offensively and defensively throwing. His error yesterday looked like a guy thinking, "don't overthrow this high" then triple bounced it to O'Hearn (Who should have picked that throw). 

 

[maybenxtyr]

1 hour ago, DirtyBird said:

Westburg would not be forced into the lineup every night. Westburg would not be forcing Urias to play 2B, or Mateo to the bench.

Just my opinion, but Westburg is a better prospect than a guy that floats around and plays occasionally. When they bring him up I would love to see him in an everyday role. 

[HakunaSakata]

1 hour ago, DirtyBird said:

At what point do you make winning games the priority and figuring out Gunnar secondary?

Gunnar isn't costing us wins, our horrendous starting pitching is.