Trading for Tarik Skubal

[Sports Guy]

2 minutes ago, Rbiggs2525 said:

I think people glossing over major mechanical issues for Skubal are being naive. His elbow has about as much pressure on it pitch to pitch as any pitcher in baseball. It’s also what makes him great. It’s what drives the high velocity and movement of his pitches. When his front leg hits the ground his arm is not anywhere near a traditional position. Just like someone pointed out last night that Crochet throws dangerously too much across his body. These guys have flaws that cannot be ignored. 

Which is why you trade for them but ultimately back off if you have trade any of the top 3.

[Rbiggs2525]

1 minute ago, Sports Guy said:

Which is why you trade for them but ultimately back off if you have trade any of the top 3.

Exactly. Cowser and Kjerstad were both top 30 prospects. I would hate to see Holiday a 5 time all star and we have a broken down pitcher.

[24fps]

18 hours ago, HowAboutThat said:

Poor Kyle Stowers, he goes to sleep every night not knowing what uniform he’ll wear tomorrow.

After praying that it's any uniform other than the Orioles so he might get a sustained opportunity to play.

[HowAboutThat]

1 minute ago, 24fps said:

After praying that it's any uniform other than the Orioles so he might get a sustained opportunity to play.

Yes, I’m sure he wants to play somewhere, and I’m sure that once he’s traded, if he’s traded, he will be delighted, but the constant “not knowing” at the same time that he knows that he’s not really wanted in Baltimore must be draining.

[Sports Guy]

Just saw a Tigers fan saying they should get all 3 of our best prospects plus Cowser or Kjerstad

[Malike]

2 minutes ago, HowAboutThat said:

Yes, I’m sure he wants to play somewhere, and I’m sure that once he’s traded, if he’s traded, he will be delighted, but the constant “not knowing” at the same time that he knows that he’s not really wanted in Baltimore must be draining.

"He's not really wanted in Baltimore" is an odd take.

[Allan Bryant]

4 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Just saw a Tigers fan saying they should get all 3 of our best prospects plus Cowser or Kjerstad

In his dreams………lol 

[Sports Guy]

Just now, Allan Bryant said:

In his dreams………lol 

Apparently there was  some rumor where Det asked for all 3

[HowAboutThat]

3 minutes ago, Malike said:

"He's not really wanted in Baltimore" is an odd take.

And it might be wrong, but it certainly is an argument that can be made for why he hasn’t been given a meaningful chance.

And there have certainly been comments suggesting that when he’s been up, he hasn’t been given a reasonable opportunity, And it could be understood if Kyle is saying to himself, “why won’t they give me a chance”

I’m not suggesting any conspiracies, but it certainly looks as if Stowers is in that no man’s land of not valuable enough to trade and not good enough to play.

Edited July 17 by HowAboutThat

[Sports Guy]

2 minutes ago, HowAboutThat said:

And it might be wrong, but it certainly is an argument that can be made for why he hasn’t been given a meaningful chance.

And there have certainly been comments suggesting that when he’s been up, he hasn’t been given a reasonable opportunity, And it could be understood if Kyle is saying to himself, “why won’t they give me a chance”

I’m not suggesting any conspiracies, but it certainly looks as if Stowers is in that no man’s land of not valuable enough to trade and not good enough to play.

You/we have no idea what type of value he has or has had on the market. I’d be a little surprised if he’s still here on July 31 unless HK is dealt.

[Rbiggs2525]

Just as information.  Skubal has never thrown 150 innings in a season and never placed top 10 in Cy Young voting. Chris Bassitt has finished top 10 3 of the past 4 years and we could probably get him for prospect 5-13.

[HowAboutThat]

1 minute ago, Sports Guy said:

You/we have no idea what type of value he has or has had on the market. I’d be a little surprised if he’s still here on July 31 unless HK is dealt.

Yeah, I’m not claiming otherwise. “the stat was descriptive and not predictive.”
haha
 

[Allan Bryant]

9 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Apparently there was  some rumor where Det asked for all 3

If that rumor is true , time move on to next target 

[Sports Guy]

I didn’t realize Skubal has had 2 major arm surgeries. I knew about the Tj surgery but not this one:

https://www.mlb.com/news/tarik-skubal-flexor-tendon-surgery

[Bemorewins]

28 minutes ago, bpilktree67 said:

You surely can’t survive giving up all the capital in the farm for 1 pitcher with arm issues in the past as well and has never thrown more then 150 innings.  If he gets injured again then you can just start the rebuild if you traded all your capital to get him.   
 

If you trade for someone like Zach Efflin who I think gets dealt as his contract was backloaded and don’t see the Rays paying him 18 million next season.  You have a rotation of Burnes, GRod, Efflin, and Kremer which is as good as any other team in AL except the Mariners but they can’t score to help there great pitching.  We will make a move it just doesn’t have to be a home run just a solid number 3 starter.  Then you look for a starter in off season once you figure out what you want to spend.  

I guess we see things differently.

Yes a move for Skubal is risky. But the opportunity cost of continuing to hedge is an even greater risk IMO.

Efflin IMO is not a difference maker. And there is no realistic deal that we can make that can cause us to "give up all the capital in the farm". This is an exaggeration that is rooted in the fear of taking a risk. But IMO you cannot make the shots that you are unwilling/afraid to take. One of Holliday/Mayo/Basallo is not and never will be all the farm. We are going to have to be bold, take risk/chances, and spend real money in order to win and sustain winning at the highest level. Point black, period. That is what the history of the game shows us and what the last decade of World Series winners proves.

IS the goal to get to the World Series? Or to do the best that we can to put ourselves in a position to win the World Series? Right now the Phillies rotation is MUCH BETTER than ours and Zach Efflin does nothing to tilt the odds in our favor if that matchup were to occur. I don't feel very good with a scenario of relying upon Efflin (a decent pitcher) or Kremer (saw that movie last year) to be on the mound with our season on the line in October. The odds are not very good of that working out IMO.

Furthermore, to your point regarding "Then you look for a starter in off season once you figure out what you want to spend", if we haven't already figured out what we want to spend next season, then shame on us for extremely poor future planning.

Everyone who says "just figure it out next year" or "worry about 25's pitching in the offseason" is being shortsighted IMO. Without Burnes we have a HUGE HOLE in our pitching staff that is already cratering. (Look at the average runs allowed in the last 25 games. It's horrid.)

The kind of consistency and quality that Burnes provides is not easy to find, replace or duplicate. And replacing him with a weaker pitcher next year, creates more problems IMO, as it does not solve the problem that we already have (not enough SP quality) and then further makes our hole/flaw on the roster that much bigger.

I don't think that it is a Skubal or bust type of situation. However, I think that we need much better pitching than we've been getting the last 25 games in order to win the big prize this season, next season, or any other. 

I prioritize pitching more than I do having our 8/9th hitter with an .750 or greater OPS when even the best offenses in the league only have 6 at most. Including Kjerstad we already have 7 of those guys. That's a championship level offense as is. But the 5+ runs a game that we have been giving up over the last month/30 games is by no means championship quality IMO.