Nats offer to Strasburg is *roughly* $20 million

[TGO]

The draft and baseball's arbitration scheme is a racket and it mostly favors owners. I don't blame a guy with this kind of talent for trying to maximize the value of his initial signing bonus. Talk of outrageous demands and inflated self-opinions are a bit over the top.

Yes, it's a game, and yes, these guys haven't played professionally and strictly speaking don't "deserve" this much money. But this is how the system is set up right now. Let's at least see where the chips fall and who signs tonight and who doesn't before we start casting aspersions.

[blueberryale77]

I don't see the need to make blanket statements about his character over his approach to negotiations.

You could easily make the argument that he's much MORE likely to listen to the coaches advice and be a team player. He's clearly listening very closely to his advisers in terms of what type of money he should be getting offered. He's very loyal to whatever they say. Sure he's clearly listening to the wrong people, but that doesn't mean he isn't a loyal guy who can take direction. If he signed, why do you assume he'd all of a sudden stop listening to other people, in this case namely his coaches?

I think Crow's making a big mistake if he doesn't sign this year, but I think its rash at best to just go throwing around these judgments of his character. I bet you've never even read anything he's said in a newspaper yet alone heard him speak, and you're already making judgments on how good of a team player he is and how open to instruction he is?

So greed and arrogance are completely unrelated from someone's character? I never said for sure that he wouldn't listen to coaches, but someone who puts himself that far above the rest of his teammates in one situation is more likely to in another. To me, the spoiled celebrities holding out for bigger contracts are a bigger scourge on the game than steroids. I have no patience for it. That's just my personal opinion.

[Mackus]

How is he listening to the wrong people? Sure, he could have probably worked out a predraft deal with the Nats for $10.5m but he's probably going to be guaranteed another $5m+.

That's $5m, for waiting to sign.

If anyone here had the option of making $5m by not working I think they would take it.

We can call it whatever we want from our perspective, but when it's your bank account and your future anything that can cost you $5m when you currently have no millions can only be classified as reckless.

I'm talking about Crow in this post, even used his name directly, not Strasburg.

[ChaosLex]

That said, if the Nats have offered him $17M, he's going to sign.

Agreed. That's why I'm only leaving this poll open for a day.

Boras might be a shark but he's not stupid.

[ejf1025]

Random question...if he desnt sign and goes back in, then doesn't sign again...does the cycle just keep going?

At what point does he become a FA?

[Mackus]

So greed and arrogance are completely unrelated from someone's character? I never said for sure that he wouldn't listen to coaches, but someone who puts himself that far above the rest of his teammates in one situation is more likely to in another. To me, the spoiled celebrities holding out for bigger contracts are a bigger scourge on the game than steroids. I have no patience for it. That's just my personal opinion.

You have no idea if he's greedy or arrogant.

Would you take a job for 30% less than what you feel you are worth? He's making a mistake in evaluating what he is worth and in who he places his trust in in terms of taking advice. But just because he's holding out for what he thinks he should be worth doesn't mean he's arrogant, greedy, a bad teammate, or a tough player to coach. Any or all of those could be true, but it would have nothing to do with his approach to these negotiations.

I just see no reason for you to judge him like that when you clearly don't know anything about him other than the fact that he hasn't signed a contract to play baseball. Make judgements about his decision-making process, sure, but why bring his character into it when you are clearly woefully uninformed as to its content?

[jerios55]

I'm talking about Crow in this post, even used his name directly, not Strasburg.

Right, which is why we shouldn't be adding Strasburg to this list if 17mill is being offered.

Crow should be an example of why Strasburg should take the money. Even if they double his offer the loss of service time might end up costing him more than the few million he wants on top of his current offer.

[Mackus]

Random question...if he desnt sign and goes back in, then doesn't sign again...does the cycle just keep going?

At what point does he become a FA?

He never becomes a FA, as far as I know. Unless, of course, nobody drafts him.

[jerios55]

You have no idea if he's greedy or arrogant.

Would you take a job for 30% less than what you feel you are worth? He's making a mistake in evaluating what he is worth and in who he places his trust in in terms of taking advice. But just because he's holding out for what he thinks he should be worth doesn't mean he's arrogant, greedy, a bad teammate, or a tough player to coach. Any or all of those could be true, but it would have nothing to do with his approach to these negotiations.

I just see no reason for you to judge him like that when you clearly don't know anything about him other than the fact that he hasn't signed a contract to play baseball. Make judgements about his decision-making process, sure, but why bring his character into it when you are clearly woefully uninformed as to its content?

Agreed. I will judge him when he needs to react to his first challenge/slump/struggle. It happens even to the best and I doubt he has seen much failure to this point. That's when you'll get a window into where his heart is in the baseball world.

[DrungoHazewood]

Let's say Strasburg declines the Nats offer and goes back into the draft for next year. If he were to fall to the O's, do you think the O's would draft him, knowing these outrageous demands?

Thoughts!?

I don't know. At least antecdotally pitchers who don't sign seem to have a pretty good rate of failure, or at least see their stock slip, after playing in an indy league or not at all for a year. You'd have to see where he is next June.

His demands are only outrageous in the context of the limited bargaining power he has because of the draft and MLB's monopoly. Sure, yes, $17M guaranteed is a heck of a lot of money, and in his situation he'll probably take it. But if he was a free agent he'd get two or three times that.

[Mackus]

Agreed. I will judge him when he needs to react to his first challenge/slump/struggle. It happens even to the best and I doubt he has seen much failure to this point. That's when you'll get a window into where his heart is in the baseball world.

Well he'll have to sign first to face that.

I think Tony said it well in his post. Crow's priorities are out of order, at least in terms of being a baseball player. Its a pretty non-specific statement but speaks to the general issue, getting the most money possible is more or at least as important to him as playing the game and hopefully making an impact. That, to me, is valid criticism and doesn't accuse Crow of being some sort of bad person. Maybe he really doesn't care all that much about baseball, none of us really understand that line of thinking 'cause we're obviously junkies, but not everybody loves this game unconditionally. If its just something he's good at, then getting the most amount of money out of it possible is a fine goal. Its not a great attribute from someone who a team is going to invest a ton of money in, but it certainly doesn't make him a bad person, "arrogant", or "greedy".

[blueberryale77]

You have no idea if he's greedy or arrogant.

Would you take a job for 30% less than what you feel you are worth? He's making a mistake in evaluating what he is worth and in who he places his trust in in terms of taking advice. But just because he's holding out for what he thinks he should be worth doesn't mean he's arrogant, greedy, a bad teammate, or a tough player to coach. Any or all of those could be true, but it would have nothing to do with his approach to these negotiations.

I just see no reason for you to judge him like that when you clearly don't know anything about him other than the fact that he hasn't signed a contract to play baseball. Make judgements about his decision-making process, sure, but why bring his character into it when you are clearly woefully uninformed as to its content?

The way I see it, if I thought I were worth >30% more than everyone else in my profession with my level of experience, that would be the very definition of arrogant. I'm not saying how coachable he is on the field or how he'd behave in the clubhouse, but holding out over money when what he's being offered is already at the extreme top end for an inexperienced player is not a good first impression and to me is a sign that you might want to watch out for other potential issues to pop up. If the issue is that he doesn't want to play for the Nats because he sees them as a poorly run organization I could have a little more sympathy, but if it's all about the money then like I said that's just something I have no patience for.

[ejf1025]

He never becomes a FA, as far as I know. Unless, of course, nobody drafts him.

Really?

I'm with Boras, that's an absurd system.

[DrungoHazewood]

He never becomes a FA, as far as I know. Unless, of course, nobody drafts him.

There used to be some loopholes, like going to play professionally in an indy league. But I think those are closed off.

The only way he becomes a free agent are:

1) Nobody drafts him

2) The team that drafts him fails to offer him a contract within 15 days of the draft, according to Rule 4(E).

3) He accrues the requisite major league service time

4) The CBA is radically restructured and the draft is eliminated or drastically changed.

[olehippi]

Ever think baseball ownership will come to their senses and realize that they are being held up without a gun by the players? Bonuses have gotten far beyond ridiculous, as have players salaries. And everything has it's breaking point.