CNN/SI: Gibbons received shipments of steriods

[blueberryale77]

Interesting that you would quote me a day later when there was only one person that stepped up and defended the statement.

I don't recall anyone saying definitively that Gibbons hadn't used steroids and all weight loss was the result of changes to his training regimen. Many people said that it could be, that there wasn't enough proof to condemn him at the time, and that it was irresponsible to state one's opinion of whether he had used steroids as fact based on that information. Those things are all still true even though new information makes it fairly clear that he did in fact use PEDs. Others of us argued that while it seemed quite likely that Gibbons used PEDs of some sort, the moral outrage was overblown and misplaced. The latest revelation doesn't change my opinion on that. I don't understand how the militant anti-steroid crowd sees this as such a black and white, "with us or against us" issue. I guess it gives me some insight into why American politics and society in general are as messed up as they are.

[PoorMike]

I don't recall anyone saying definitively that Gibbons hadn't used steroids and all weight loss was the result of changes to his training regimen. Many people said that it could be, that there wasn't enough proof to condemn him at the time, and that it was irresponsible to state one's opinion of whether he had used steroids as fact based on that information. Those things are all still true even though new information makes it fairly clear that he did in fact use PEDs. Others of us argued that while it seemed quite likely that Gibbons used PEDs of some sort, the moral outrage was overblown and misplaced. The latest revelation doesn't change my opinion on that. I don't understand how the militant anti-steroid crowd sees this as such a black and white, "with us or against us" issue. I guess it gives me some insight into why American politics and society in general are as messed up as they are.

I thought that the circumstantial stuff made it possible that he had juiced, but we had to deal with the player that was in front of us, jucer or not. The guy that was playing for us had to get better as he wasn't even worthy of being on the roster at the beginning of the season. Absence any proof, we had him for better of for worse and no one was going to take him off our hands.

I was staunchly against releasing him, mostly because that meant that the 12M was gone forever with no chance to trade him and no chance to benefit from him when he bounced back. Also, about .0001% of me thought that if he was ever suspended, the O's wouldn't have to pay him for the games he missed.

[bgtimber75]

Others of us argued that while it seemed quite likely that Gibbons used PEDs of some sort, the moral outrage was overblown and misplaced. The latest revelation doesn't change my opinion on that. I don't understand how the militant anti-steroid crowd sees this as such a black and white, "with us or against us" issue. I guess it gives me some insight into why American politics and society in general are as messed up as they are.

Just to be clear. I don't care one way or the other if he did steroids. What angers me is that he did steroids and he still sucked. What also angers me is that he's not the sharpest knife in the drawer to get these shipped to himself.

[tywright]

Ankiel, Glaus, Gibbons...all had injury problems and took the roids and hGH to recover quicker. Let's hope we don't see Roberts' name

[PoorMike]

Just to be clear. I don't care one way or the other if he did steroids. What angers me is that he did steroids and he still sucked. What also angers me is that he's not the sharpest knife in the drawer to get these shipped to himself.

The thing that makes the most sense to me, if he did them, is that he was a 20-25hr, 70-80rbi hitter when he was on them, but that he may have been the 2007 guy when he wasn't. Even if he wasn't as bad as he was this year, if he did PED's it may have taken him a while to actually re-learn what the limits, timing, strength, etc of his new, post-PED body was.

That is, if he did them, of course.

[PoorMike]

Ankiel, Glaus, Gibbons...all had injury problems and took the roids and hGH to recover quicker. Let's hope we don't see Roberts' name

Roberts hit more HRs in 2005 before his injury. If he did them before 2005, that shouldn't be his excuse.

I hope someone who had chilhood heart issues would not do that, even though I believe he works out with JG in ARZ each offseason.

[FellsPointOsFan]

I hope someone who had chilhood heart issues would not do that, even though I believe he works out with JG in ARZ each offseason.

There's a whole bunch of MLB players as well as other professional athletes who go to the same joint.

http://www.athletesperformance.com/

[LookitsPuck]

Well the only way to prove if he used steroids is to ask Mrs. Gibbons. Like I said "Smaller Potatoes Make the Meat Look Bigger"

Interestingly enough, steroids do increase bat size.

[DynamicDuo]

I've seen Roger Cosack say on ESPN that just because you tell someone that information is private does not mean that it can't be subpoenaed.

I think he's wrong, only because this is medical information. The players agreed to have these medical tests done on the condition on anonymity and didn't not waive medical privlege. The fed's have no right to the names.

I think he's right. There is no doctor-patient privilege recognized in federal law (only a pyschotherapist-patient privilege). Submitting to medical tests on the condition of anonymity only prevents those involved in the testing from releasing his name. It does not prevent the feds from subpoening the information or from compelling those involved to obey the subpoena.

[DynamicDuo]

re: debate over whether Gibbons' contract can be voided

A year ago the Yankees were looking into possibly voiding Giambi's contract over steroid use. Does anyone remember why they decided not to attempt it? In my opinion, the Orioles do have a strong misrepresentation argument against Gibbons, which would void the contract. Without looking at the specific language of the CBA, I don't know how that would affect the outcome.

[blueberryale77]

There's a whole bunch of MLB players as well as other professional athletes who go to the same joint.

http://www.athletesperformance.com/

Interesting that you mention that. I was just reading their site last night while searching for more info on JG. They at least present themselves as having a very strong PED policy:

The Athletes' Performance Commitment to Winning with Integrity

At Athletes' Performance, we provide the finest performance methods,

specialists, and facilities to help our athletes attain their goals in an

ethical manner. One of our company's fundamental beliefs is that through

the application of our scientifically proven systems, any athlete can reach

his or her goals without the aid of performance enhancing drugs. Our

athletes have proven this by not just winning, but Winning with Integrity, while earning nearly every accolade in every sport.

Athletes' Performance founder Mark Verstegen's strong commitment to winning with integrity led to the creation of an industry first Athlete's Ethics Statement in which all of our athletes vow that they will not use any performance enhancing drugs while a member of the Athletes' Performance Community.

By joining the Athletes' Performance Community online, you too, are agreeing to achieve your optimal performance by Winning with Integrity. We ask all members, on-site and online, to make the same commitment as everyone at Athletes' Performance. If this commitment is ever broken while being a member of the AP Community, our members will lose all privileges, money, and ability to return to Athletes' Performance.

One of the articles mentioned that Gibbons was in Arizona at present recuperating from his labrum surgery. I would imagine he's been going to physical therapy there. I wonder if they gave him the boot? I also wonder how this affects BRob. Assuming there's no revelation about him, do they also ask him not to come back because he's too closely associated with Gibbons (and Jerry Hairston)? Does he not want to go back after they booted his good friend even if it was for clearly justifiable reasons? I feel really bad for him right now because whether or not he did anything he's in a very uncomfortable situation which, like he said about Raffy back in 2005, "I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy."

[Sapper]

Aslong as it's only Jay Gibbons that we have to worry about, I'll be fine with it. But i'm not sure anyone can say that they'd be surprised if Gibbons was a steroid user.

I wouldn't. He's not my favorite player either. Seems like kind of a meathead to me.

[PoorMike]

I think he's right. There is no doctor-patient privilege recognized in federal law (only a pyschotherapist-patient privilege). Submitting to medical tests on the condition of anonymity only prevents those involved in the testing from releasing his name. It does not prevent the feds from subpoening the information or from compelling those involved to obey the subpoena.

This one is tricky.

I know that Federal law supercedes state laws for the most part, but if a federal law simply does not cover a certain area, a state law can amend it. For example, federal housing discrimination has a set of laws which define protected classes. State laws can then add to those protected classes.

I don't know if the feds can ignore patient confidentiality in a state that recognizes it.

We'll know at some point. I don't think the feds have the 2004 (or was it 2003) names yet.

[scOtt]

Interestingly enough, steroids do increase bat size.

I don't think we should speculate on that til we hear a definitive statement from Mrs. Jay.

[PaulFolk]

I'm really not trying to start anything, but aren't Jay and B-Rob best friends? So mayb Brian at least knew about thus and could have joined in? Just speculating.

This is the second or third time someone has said this, and it still doesn't make sense to me. So what if they're friends? Since when are friends required to do exactly the same things as each other? I have a friend who's a yoga teacher and a vegetarian, but that doesn't mean I have the slightest interest in taking up either of those habits.

It's irresponsible, IMO, to be throwing Brian Roberts's name out for suspicion because of something Jay Gibbons did.