Let's go for it.

[Frobby]

Renewed bet? With a self-imposed year-long ban? If the Orioles offense is not one iota better than last year (we'll mark it by runs, if you like, or by OPS) I'll happily leave for a year. If it is one iota better (i.e., more runs or better OPS) you go away for a year.

This sounds like a can't lose proposition for the rest of us!

For the record, I am kidding.

[Lucky Jim]

This sounds like a can't lose proposition for the rest of us!

For the record, I am kidding.

Behind every joke.

Seriously, though - the instinct behind it was pretty much "no great loss, some small gain." Regarding both posters.

[Hank Scorpio]

Hank,

If given the choice who would you rather have at 3rd base Miggy or Crede ? Tejada does have have baggage and declining numbers, but if he performs well he's good trade bait come July.

If I HAD to pick one of them, I'd rather have Crede. But there's no good reason to expect Crede to get through 150 games in a season.

The best case scenario would be Josh Bell BLOWIN' UP at Norfolk after a strong showing in Spring Training, punting on Crede in late May and having Bell as our everyday third baseman.

[Dr. Andrews]

And baseball was eons different back then.

In 2001, believe it or not, the Angels were 75-87, and 2nd to last in their division, before winning in 2002.

In 2002, Florida was 2nd to last in their division (79-83) before winning in 2003.

The 2006 Tigers were 2nd to last in their division in 2005 (71-91) before making it to the World Series the following year.

...and the '07 Rockies/'08 Rays were both in last place in their divisions the year before ending up in the World Series.

It's certainly not out of the realm of possibility.

[jdouble777]

What are we going for, 3rd place?

Yes. In 2010 that is exactly the progression that needs to happen.

[jdouble777]

:rofl::rofl::laughlol::mwahaha:Jim Palmer, Dave McNally and Mike Cueller pitching like they did in 1969 couldn't get this team to 85 wins with the current offense. You are living on Fantasy Island if you think this team is going to win more than 7 games over last season no matter what the young pitching does. It just ain't happening without some proven hitting added.

Weiters hit .301 post All-Star break and was the TOP prospect in all of baseball before the season:

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/splits?playerId=29287

Adam Jones hit .303 and 12 HRs before the All-Star break and was 23 years young:

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/splits?playerId=28513

Nick Markakis finished the season hitting .293 w/ 101 RBIs, again:

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/splits?playerId=6478

Brian Roberts hit 16 HRs w/ 79 RBIs from LEADOFF, also stole 30 bags, and as always hovered around .300:

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/splits?playerId=4773

Nolan Reimold hit .299 post All-Star and finished w/ 15 HRs on just 358 ABs:

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/splits?playerId=28974

Felix Pie hit .290 post All-Star while knocking 9 HRs on just 145 ABs, full-time that is on pace for 30 HRs:

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/splits?playerId=6475

Luke Scott hit .308 before the All-Star and finished w/ 25 HRs on just 449 ABs, give him 550-600 and he knocks 30 HRs:

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/splits?playerId=6229

Therefore, I call BS.

Pie, Jones, Weiters, Reimold were between 23-25 and are now 24-26 so growth and improvement is to be expected. If that happens, we have all the offense a fan could desire. Especially if someone teaches Pie to steal bases.

[jdouble777]

If I HAD to pick one of them, I'd rather have Crede. But there's no good reason to expect Crede to get through 150 games in a season.

The best case scenario would be Josh Bell BLOWIN' UP at Norfolk after a strong showing in Spring Training, punting on Crede in late May and having Bell as our everyday third baseman.

This seems somewhat absurd. Let us sign someone who is undoubtedly going to get injured, hit for less average, and has worse defense than someone who is the opposite of all those things because? Let us take a gamble on some injury prone player with no contact and bank on Bell "BLOWN' UP?" That just does not seem like good baseball to me. Miggy has the same baggage Brian Roberts has so that is no excuse. He will stay healthy, hit .300, and play average to above average defense.

[Hank Scorpio]

This seems somewhat absurd. Let us sign someone who is undoubtedly going to get injured, hit for less average, and has worse defense than someone who is the opposite of all those things because? Let us take a gamble on some injury prone player with no contact and bank on Bell "BLOWN' UP?" That just does not seem like good baseball to me. Miggy has the same baggage Brian Roberts has so that is no excuse. He will stay healthy, hit .300, and play average to above average defense.

That's why I said if I "HAD" to pick one. I want nothing to do with either of them.

Either put Luke Scott at first base, or deal him, sign LaRoche and make Atkins the third baseman until Bell is ready.

[Hank Scorpio]

This seems somewhat absurd. Let us sign someone who is undoubtedly going to get injured, hit for less average, and has worse defense than someone who is the opposite of all those things because? Let us take a gamble on some injury prone player with no contact and bank on Bell "BLOWN' UP?" That just does not seem like good baseball to me. Miggy has the same baggage Brian Roberts has so that is no excuse. He will stay healthy, hit .300, and play average to above average defense.

I prefer the guy who has, you know, played third base.

What's absurd is putting Tejada over there and expecting good defense.

By the way: http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/crede-flying-under-the-radar-again

[jdouble777]

I prefer the guy who has, you know, played third base.

What's absurd is putting Tejada over there and expecting good defense.

By the way: http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/crede-flying-under-the-radar-again

Joe Crede:

2007- .216

2008- .248

2009- .225

Miguel Tejada:

2007- .296

2008- .283

2009- .313

SS is far more difficult to play than 3B, if A Rod can do it, I'm banking on Tejada to not be terrible. Sure, Crede may up him a couple points UZR, but his average is horrid. Horrid. Crede is as easy an out as they come. Tejada will be on base all day everyday.

[waroriole]

Tejada will be on base all day everyday.

Only if he gets hits, b/c he sure ain't walking.

[Hank Scorpio]

Joe Crede:

2007- .216

2008- .248

2009- .225

Miguel Tejada:

2007- .296

2008- .283

2009- .313

SS is far more difficult to play than 3B, if A Rod can do it, I'm banking on Tejada to not be terrible. Sure, Crede may up him a couple points UZR, but his average is horrid. Horrid. Crede is as easy an out as they come. Tejada will be on base all day everyday.

Yeah, they're both bad options.

[jdouble777]

That's why I said if I "HAD" to pick one. I want nothing to do with either of them.

Either put Luke Scott at first base, or deal him, sign LaRoche and make Atkins the third baseman until Bell is ready.

I love how we bank on these guys who have never played in the majors. What is to say his does not pull a Snyder and bomb in Triple A? Unlikely, but certainly possible. Tejada gives you flexibility and a cushion until they are ready.

If Atkins comes out still hitting .220 and Crede is hitting .220 then you can call it a season.

Personally, I'm fine with Scott there and Atkins at 3B for now. I do think Tejada would add a lot of runs though. Personally, I would prefer to sign Tejada and package Scott, Reimold/Pie, and Snyder for Butler or something more certain.

[El Gordo]

Oh, jeez. I'm just giving him grief about the last bet he backed out of. They hardly do any damage because no one ever takes them up.

The point is simply that people need to measure their words. O5F is always stating a position of extremity as if it's fact. And the only way to have him back off of it is to leverage it against something real world.

I won't do it anymore, which is fine.

But how's it divisive, in the end? Divisive? Does O5F get his friends and I keep mine in the divorce? Or? I mean, no one's being forced into anything, and no one's even being insulted. There are things that cross a line, but sheesh. That's hardly it.

What does have a place on the board?

If it walks like a duck, quacks ....etc.

[DrungoHazewood]

Joe Crede:

2007- .216

2008- .248

2009- .225

Miguel Tejada:

2007- .296

2008- .283

2009- .313

SS is far more difficult to play than 3B, if A Rod can do it, I'm banking on Tejada to not be terrible. Sure, Crede may up him a couple points UZR, but his average is horrid. Horrid. Crede is as easy an out as they come. Tejada will be on base all day everyday.

I don't know if you did this on purpose, but you've picked batting average to represent these two guys. This is problematic for any number of reasons, but most of all:

a) Since Tejada's power is disappearing and he walks less frequently than almost anyone in baseball that's pretty much the sum total of his offense. If he hits .260 or .270 he's a pretty bad hitter, especially for a third baseman.

b) It completely ignores the fact that Tejada has never played third base while Crede is consistently a very good third baseman.

I don't want Joe Crede, since he's David Segui fragile and he's not much of a hitter. But Tejada comes with a whole host of problems and risks, including age, points (a) and (b) above, and contract demands.