Is Sisco Toast?

[Frobby]

2 hours ago, Aristotelian said:

I am saying that 0 wins could be an improvement over Sisco. I am willing to concede that the lack of other options keeps him in play for now, but I am convinced that he is not a catcher long term, so what's the point?

Whether Sisco makes the OD roster next year is anyone’s guess. But he has an option, and will be on the 40-man.   Book it.   

[thezeroes]

26 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

The broader picture of things is that you have AR in the minors so in all probability you have a starting catcher for your 2021 squad already. 

That was my thought.  The Orioles also took Maverick Handley out of Standford  in the sixth round this year.  Jordan Cannon, Catcher/Relief pitcher was taken in the 10th round out of Sam Houston

[BohKnowsBmore]

31 minutes ago, thezeroes said:

With all this Sisco being Toast talk I do believe that a reminder is needed for some. 

Currently the Orioles number one catcher by default is Pedro Severino.  He was a member of the Washington Nationals right up until March 23, 2019 when Management claimed him off waivers.  Catchers and backup players without options or that are part of a roster crunch always are waived at the end of Spring Training.  If our front office does it Due Diligence then Sisco's replacement on the Twenty-Five may become available again next spring.  Chance has one option remaining so there is time for him to "Get it right" another year in Spring Training or Norfolk.  This entire thread seems to be populated with more opinions than facts with little thought to a broader picture of things.  Thankfully this board is not running the Orioles.

Well said. There is almost zero reason to send him packing, even if he doesn’t start 2020 on the 25. 

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, thezeroes said:

That was my thought.  The Orioles also took Maverick Handley out of Standford  in the sixth round this year.  Jordan Cannon, Catcher/Relief pitcher was taken in the 10th round

Always need a lot of catchers.

[thezeroes]

2 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Always need a lot of catchers.

In 2014 the Orioles took ZERO Catchers in the June Draft.  Talk about lack of increasing depth.  116 catchers were taken in that draft. 

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, thezeroes said:

In 2014 the Orioles took ZERO Catchers in the June Draft.  Talk about lack of increasing depth.  116 catchers were taken in that draft. 

And those guys are gone.

[thezeroes]

10 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

And those guys are gone.

In 2016 the management team that is gone again did not draft any catchers in the June Draft.  114 catchers were drafted.

[Can_of_corn]

6 minutes ago, thezeroes said:

In 2016 the management team that is gone again did not draft any catchers in the June Draft.  114 catchers were drafted.

Shocking they lasted that long.

[DrungoHazewood]

11 hours ago, thezeroes said:

In 2016 the management team that is gone again did not draft any catchers in the June Draft.  114 catchers were drafted.

Someone check my math, but I think that if you a) assume catchers are distributed evenly across rounds/talent, b) there were 40 rounds, c) the Orioles took the best available player each round... 1200 players drafted, 9.5% were catchers, carry the one... there's about a 2% chance that the Orioles not taking a catcher the whole draft was the best choice.  

Kind of remote, but relying on assumptions about distribution of catcher talent.  But also not zero.  There have been 54 drafts, 2% would be once every 50 drafts.  It could happen.

Also, the Orioles took 27 pitchers out of their 40 picks in 2016.  They were clearly targeting pitchers.  Odds are much higher that they correctly, logically wouldn't select a catcher with their 13 position players if you assume they were targeting something like 27 pitchers.  Something like a 27% chance that no catcher was the best choice out of 13 rounds.

[DrungoHazewood]

Also, I don't think it's unusual to get seemingly weird distributions of positions in a draft.

In 2000 the Orioles took seven catchers, but just five outfielders, no second basemen, three shortstops and one third baseman.

In 2001 they only took six infielders and two catchers in 50 rounds. 

In 2002 they took just two shortstops, none before the 16th round.

In 2003 they took no first basemen.

In 2012 they took six catchers and seven total infielders.

In 2014 they didn't take a shortstop until the 27th round.

In 2007 the Rays didn't draft a shortstop at all.

The 2010 Pirates didn't draft any infielders or a catchers until the 15th round.

The 2016 Twins didn't take any first or second basemen and a single third baseman.

[Can_of_corn]

I don't think very many players are drafted as second basemen.

[Frobby]

16 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I don't think very many players are drafted as second basemen.

This year, 38 players drafted were listed as 2B.   123 were listed at SS, 50 3B, 48 1B, 199 OF, 102 C.   654 pitchers.  

[DrungoHazewood]

4 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

I don't think very many players are drafted as second basemen.

Mike Fontenot!  #19 overall by the O's in 2001, but was actually the 2nd 2nd baseman taken that draft after Chris Burke.  Fontenot was an unconventional pick, and being from the Syd Thrift era widely panned.  But his 4.3-win career is in the top third of all 2001 first rounders. Ended up with a better career than much more hyped players like John Van Benschoten, Colt Griffin, and Dewon Brazelton.  And not too far from the epic Casey Kotchman.

[atomic]

4 hours ago, Frobby said:

This year, 38 players drafted were listed as 2B.   123 were listed at SS, 50 3B, 48 1B, 199 OF, 102 C.   654 pitchers.  

I would suspect a lot of Shortstops and Catchers are known at the draft time that they aren't good enough defensively to stay at those positions.  

[Frobby]

10 minutes ago, atomic said:

I would suspect a lot of Shortstops and Catchers are known at the draft time that they aren't good enough defensively to stay at those positions.  

There’s definitely a lot of guys drafted at SS who end up being major leaguers at other positions.    I’m not sure how true that is at catcher.