Would Mike Yastrzemski’s breakout have occurred if he was with the Orioles this year?

[UpstateNYfan]

 

18 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I don’t agree.   Yaz was just way down our depth chart.   See the quote from BA on the previous page.    Nobody thought he was a major league piece.    He was behind Hays, Diaz, Stewart, Mullins, McKenna and others on our MiL depth chart.  Even Mason Williams was considered a more valuable short term asset if we needed someone to call up. Simple as that.     

 

You missed my point completely or I explained poorly. I never suggested he should have been brought up. I suggested that in the past the DD/BS regime would prefer a vet versus a MiLer in most cases. I realize he was low on the depth chart and was released..that is fine, the right choice by Elias IMO. I said I was glad he got a chance, that's all and OH'ers shouldn't whine about it. And lastly, I believe there are a number of players that develop later, that are written off before given a chance. Everybody doesn't walk at the same age, speak at the same age, read at the same age. You can place all those developmental stages statistically. We tend with the statistics dynamics of baseball to write off some potentially talented players based on purely statistics. It is more fun to me to see guy tossed away having success or some 20th round draft choice make it than the anointed first and second rounders.

[thezeroes]

Little Yaz was never protected in the Rule 5 Draft and never drafted by another team.  He was not protected in the MiLB phase of the draft and not selected by another team, he was not coveted by any of the other 29 teams or their Minor League teams.  He was not a commodity worth a whole lot to the Orioles or any of the other twenty-nine teams.

[Frobby]

1 minute ago, UpstateNYfan said:

 

You missed my point completely or I explained poorly. I never suggested he should have been brought up. I suggested that in the past the DD/BS regime would prefer a vet versus a MiLer in most cases. I realize he was low on the depth chart and was released..that is fine, the right choice by Elias IMO. I said I was glad he got a chance, that's all and OH'ers shouldn't whine about it. And lastly, I believe there are a number of players that develop later, that are written off before given a chance. Everybody doesn't walk at the same age, speak at the same age, read at the same age. You can place all those developmental stages statistically. We tend with the statistics dynamics of baseball to write off some potentially talented players based on purely statistics. It is more fun to me to see guy tossed away having success or some 20th round draft choice make it than the anointed first and second rounders.

Thanks for the clarification.   I agree with everything you said here.   

[DrungoHazewood]

8 hours ago, orioles22 said:

I saw Arrieta pitch in Myrtle Beach and he was electric. It seems he was one of the top pitchers at every level - can't believe we let him go so fast.

The Orioles signed Jake Arrieta in 2007 and traded him in mid-2013.  Six years is "so fast"?  Arrieta was traded in 2013, at the age of 27, after allowing 42 baserunners and 19 runs in 23 innings.  After a 2012 where he had a 6.20 ERA in 114 innings.  Following a  2011 where he had a 5.05 in 119 innings.  69 MLB games and 358 innings of a 5.46 isn't enough for you?   Then how about a 4.02 ERA in Norfolk at 26, back when Harbor Park was one of the best pitcher's environments in baseball?  Or then a 4.41 in AAA Norfolk in 49 innings at 27? 

Over his last 200-odd innings with the Orioles he was giving up runs at an Gabriel Ynoa or Aaron Brooks rate.

[DrungoHazewood]

5 minutes ago, thezeroes said:

Little Yaz was never protected in the Rule 5 Draft and never drafted by another team.  He was not protected in the MiLB phase of the draft and not selected by another team, he was not coveted by any of the other 29 teams or their Minor League teams.  He was not a commodity worth a whole lot to the Orioles or any of the other twenty-nine teams.

Perhaps they should have let him take batting practice with Home Run Derby balls and surmised that one day those would be used in the Majors.

[orioles22]

5 hours ago, DrungoHazewood said:

The Orioles signed Jake Arrieta in 2007 and traded him in mid-2013.  Six years is "so fast"?  Arrieta was traded in 2013, at the age of 27, after allowing 42 baserunners and 19 runs in 23 innings.  After a 2012 where he had a 6.20 ERA in 114 innings.  Following a  2011 where he had a 5.05 in 119 innings.  69 MLB games and 358 innings of a 5.46 isn't enough for you?   Then how about a 4.02 ERA in Norfolk at 26, back when Harbor Park was one of the best pitcher's environments in baseball?  Or then a 4.41 in AAA Norfolk in 49 innings at 27? 

Over his last 200-odd innings with the Orioles he was giving up runs at an Gabriel Ynoa or Aaron Brooks rate.

To me, it was. I was a big Arrieta fan. He was one of the best in the International League in 2010, won 10 games for the Orioles in 2011 and was gone less the two years later.

Edited October 5, 2019 by orioles22

[Redskins Rick]

1 minute ago, orioles22 said:

To me, it was. I was a big Arrieta fan. He was one of the best in the International League in 2010, won 10 games for the Orioles in 2011 and was gone less the two years later.

Jake was gone, because of his own doing, he forgot how to pitch and get hitters out.

He was Mike Wright bad.

People were helping him back his bags, and drive him to the bus station, they were finished with him.

Fortunately for himself, he was able to fix his stuff and found it easier to pitch in the NL.

[weams]

On 10/5/2019 at 9:46 AM, DrungoHazewood said:

The Orioles signed Jake Arrieta in 2007 and traded him in mid-2013.  Six years is "so fast"?  Arrieta was traded in 2013, at the age of 27, after allowing 42 baserunners and 19 runs in 23 innings.  After a 2012 where he had a 6.20 ERA in 114 innings.  Following a  2011 where he had a 5.05 in 119 innings.  69 MLB games and 358 innings of a 5.46 isn't enough for you?   Then how about a 4.02 ERA in Norfolk at 26, back when Harbor Park was one of the best pitcher's environments in baseball?  Or then a 4.41 in AAA Norfolk in 49 innings at 27? 

Over his last 200-odd innings with the Orioles he was giving up runs at an Gabriel Ynoa or Aaron Brooks rate.

He could not get outs in the minors and would not listen to Scott McGregor when attempting to help as well. 

[weams]

19 hours ago, Redskins Rick said:

Jake was gone, because of his own doing, he forgot how to pitch and get hitters out.

He was Mike Wright bad.

People were helping him back his bags, and drive him to the bus station, they were finished with him.

Fortunately for himself, he was able to fix his stuff and found it easier to pitch in the NL.

Jake was awful. Heck he was our opening day pitcher and he could not, would not, hack it with out being busted down to the level that he no longer had and support network and had to do as told to have a job. 

[weams]

20 hours ago, orioles22 said:

To me, it was. I was a big Arrieta fan. He was one of the best in the International League in 2010, won 10 games for the Orioles in 2011 and was gone less the two years later.

Jake was a real bad starter. He might have worked as a closer. Who knows. 

[Tx Oriole]

1 hour ago, weams said:

He could not get outs in the minors and would not listen to Scott McGregor when attempting to help as well. 

That’s all on Jake. I don’t understand why a young pitcher thinks he knows it all and won’t listen to a vet pitcher? It might have helped him with the O’s. But I’m glad he went to the Cubs.

[sportsfan8703]

I think they would have given Yaz the Smith Jr role. He would’ve hit 2nd between Villar and Mancini to start out. So yes, his breakout would’ve happened here. 

[POR]

19 hours ago, Tx Oriole said:

That’s all on Jake. I don’t understand why a young pitcher thinks he knows it all and won’t listen to a vet pitcher? It might have helped him with the O’s. But I’m glad he went to the Cubs.

No it is not all on Jake. A big part of player development is getting the most out of a players ability.  The Orioles were  far too rigid in messing with his delivery and using their mechanics.  it is not a one size fits all process.

Scott McGregor was a good pitcher and is probably a nice guy, but he was a minor league pitcher instructor for years and did very little to distinguish himself in my opinion.

[POR]

20 hours ago, weams said:

Jake was a real bad starter. He might have worked as a closer. Who knows. 

There was a period of time when Arrieta was the best starting pitcher in baseball,  Of course, he could of been successful here.

[POR]

As for Yaz, I see no reason he could not have had the same success for the Orioles in 2019.  The bigger question is whether he is a one year wonder.