Contraction of MiLB

[MurphDogg]

2 hours ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Also, the Nats just moved their Carolina League team to Fredericksburg for 2020.  I doubt they'd abandon a newly-relocated team and brand-new $35M stadium to move into Frederick and 31-year-old Harry Grove.

They would shift their Sally League team there to replace the contracted Hagerstown Suns.

[Bill Swaggerty]

42 minutes ago, MurphDogg said:

They would shift their Sally League team there to replace the contracted Hagerstown Suns.

That's a possibility, but I think the reshuffle will be quite complex. It's really hard to know just how this will all shake out. 

It's also been mentioned that MLB would like to contract the minors again in the next five years, getting down to just 90 teams at 3 levels. 

[Chuck A]

On 4/28/2020 at 8:23 AM, DrungoHazewood said:

Also, the Nats just moved their Carolina League team to Fredericksburg for 2020.  I doubt they'd abandon a newly-relocated team and brand-new $35M stadium to move into Frederick and 31-year-old Harry Grove.

You know you're old when you was there at the opening of "31-year-old Harry Grove".   What was the name of the stadium the Keys played in their first year?  McCurdy Field?

[MCO'sFan]

On 4/30/2020 at 1:33 PM, Chuck A said:

You know you're old when you was there at the opening of "31-year-old Harry Grove".   What was the name of the stadium the Keys played in their first year?  McCurdy Field?

Yes, but I would hardly call it a stadium. I can't believe that pro players played there. Its small for legion ball.

[wildcard]

I don't think we will see the Keys contracted or even leave the O's minor league system.  The fanbase attendance is the 2nd best for the O's minor leagues and fanbases are hard to grow and harder to give up.

Here are the O's fanbase and capacity of O's minor league ball parks:  (Attendance for 2018-2019)

AAA   Norfolk    Harbor Park       Attendance: 5300/game       Capacity:  11,856

AA  Bowie   Prince Georges     Attendance: 3200-3400/game   Capacity:  10,000

A+  Frederick   Harry Grove      Attendance: 4300-4400 /game     Capacity:   5400

A  Delmarva     Perdue         Attendance:  3100-3300/game    Capacity:   5200

Short A   Aberdeen   Ripken    Attendance:  3200- 3500/game   Capacity   6300  

There are no AAA teams on the contraction list so I think Harbor Park is safe.  And there are no other parks or fanbases with that capacity or fans  in the O's area except Richmond which if it change affiliations would probably go to the Nationals instead of them playing their AAA  Fresno.

Though Bowie's attendance is low for a AA club its capacity of 10,000 will probably keep it a AA club in the O's organization.

Frederick's fanbase is too high to contract and if Hagerstown is contracted (30 minute away) it might even increase attendances.  The park may be old and the city not having the money to improve it  just keeps it a A level club instead of allowing it to  move up to AA.

Aberdeen's Ripken Park is newer and has more capacity then Perdue Stadium.  If the O's contract a team it is likely to be Delmarva in the NY Penn League IMO.

Delmarva could become the Nationals Sally League team with Hagerstown being contracted.

JMO

https://ballparkdigest.com/2019/09/09/2019-affiliated-attendance-by-league/

 

 

 

 

 

[Bill Swaggerty]

On 6/5/2020 at 3:43 PM, wildcard said:

I don't think we will see the Keys contracted or even leave the O's minor league system.  The fanbase attendance is the 2nd best for the O's minor leagues and fanbases are hard to grow and harder to give up.

Here are the O's fanbase and capacity of O's minor league ball parks:  (Attendance for 2018-2019)

AAA   Norfolk    Harbor Park       Attendance: 5300/game       Capacity:  11,856

AA  Bowie   Prince Georges     Attendance: 3200-3400/game   Capacity:  10,000

A+  Frederick   Harry Grove      Attendance: 4300-4400 /game     Capacity:   5400

A  Delmarva     Perdue         Attendance:  3100-3300/game    Capacity:   5200

Short A   Aberdeen   Ripken    Attendance:  3200- 3500/game   Capacity   6300  

There are no AAA teams on the contraction list so I think Harbor Park is safe.  And there are no other parks or fanbases with that capacity or fans  in the O's area except Richmond which if it change affiliations would probably go to the Nationals instead of them playing their AAA  Fresno.

Though Bowie's attendance is low for a AA club its capacity of 10,000 will probably keep it a AA club in the O's organization.

Frederick's fanbase is too high to contract and if Hagerstown is contracted (30 minute away) it might even increase attendances.  The park may be old and the city not having the money to improve it  just keeps it a A level club instead of allowing it to  move up to AA.

Aberdeen's Ripken Park is newer and has more capacity then Perdue Stadium.  If the O's contract a team it is likely to be Delmarva in the NY Penn League IMO.

Delmarva could become the Nationals Sally League team with Hagerstown being contracted.

JMO

https://ballparkdigest.com/2019/09/09/2019-affiliated-attendance-by-league/

 

 

 

 

 

Attendance is not at the top of the list of factors when deciding which clubs to keep or contract. It's more about facilities. Frederick's playing field and locker rooms are subpar. Further, the prospects for improvement are low because Harry Grove is owned by the city. 

[wildcard]

15 hours ago, Bill Swaggerty said:

Attendance is not at the top of the list of factors when deciding which clubs to keep or contract. It's more about facilities. Frederick's playing field and locker rooms are subpar. Further, the prospects for improvement are low because Harry Grove is owned by the city. 

I understand your thought here but I don't see the O's walking away from the Frederick fan base.   Remember the Angelos teamed with Sarasota to overhaul that ball park.    Mike Young owns the Frederick, Bowie and Norfolk franchises.   I think something can be worked out.   It more likely IMO than Bowie, Delmarva or Aberdeen improving their fan base by 1000 fans a game.  And remember Hagerstown is being contracted which may add fans at Frederick.

With that fan base there will be a team in Frederick after contraction and I don't see the O's just handing it to the Nationals.

[Can_of_corn]

4 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I understand your thought here but I don't see the O's walking away from the Frederick fan base.   Remember the Angelos teamed with Sarasota to overhaul that ball park.    Mike Young owns the Frederick, Bowie and Norfolk franchises.   I think something can be worked out.   It more likely IMO than Bowie, Delmarva or Aberdeen improving their fan base by 1000 fans a game.  And remember Hagerstown is being contracted which may add fans at Frederick.

With that fan base there will be a team in Frederick after contraction and I don't see the O's just handing it to the Nationals.

If by teamed with Sarasota you mean had Sarasota pay for it then yes, they teamed up.

 

[Bill Swaggerty]

Just now, wildcard said:

I understand your thought here but I don't see the O's walking away from the Frederick fan base.   Remember the Angelos teamed with Sarasota to overall that ball park.    Mike Young owns the Frederick, Bowie and Norfolk franchises.   I think something can be worked out.   It more likely IMO than Bowie, Delmarva or Aberdeen improving their fan base by 1000 fans a game.  And remember Hagerstown is being contracted which may add fans at Frederick.

All possibilities. 

The Orioles surely value their Frederick-area fans and the O's could very well be lobbying for the franchise to remain. But contraction is part of a larger movement driven by MLB. Even if the Orioles want to stay in Frederick, the rest of MLB knows the condition of the field and facililties. That's why the Keys were on the initial cut list.  It likely isn't as simple as what the Orioles want to do. 

 

I love Municipal Stadium in Hagerstown, but that place was EMPTY most nights. Official average attendance was less that 1,000 last year. I'm not sure how much of a bump Frederick would get if the Suns dissolve.

I really hope both teams remain. I live roughly the same distance from Hagerstown and Frederick and go to several games per year. 

[wildcard]

On 6/11/2020 at 8:41 AM, Bill Swaggerty said:

All possibilities. 

The Orioles surely value their Frederick-area fans and the O's could very well be lobbying for the franchise to remain. But contraction is part of a larger movement driven by MLB. Even if the Orioles want to stay in Frederick, the rest of MLB knows the condition of the field and facililties. That's why the Keys were on the initial cut list.  It likely isn't as simple as what the Orioles want to do. 

 

I love Municipal Stadium in Hagerstown, but that place was EMPTY most nights. Official average attendance was less that 1,000 last year. I'm not sure how much of a bump Frederick would get if the Suns dissolve.

I really hope both teams remain. I live roughly the same distance from Hagerstown and Frederick and go to several games per year. 

The Nationals would be chumping at the bit to take over Frederick and improve the park to get the fan base.  The question is will the O's let them?

[Can_of_corn]

32 minutes ago, wildcard said:

The Nationals would be chumping at the bit to take over Frederick and improve the park to get the fan base.  The question is will the O's let them?

I'm not sold that they would end a relationship with a team just so they can spend money to upgrade another team's facilities.

[bobmc]

2 hours ago, wildcard said:

The Nationals would be chumping at the bit to take over Frederick and improve the park to get the fan base.  The question is will the O's let them?

Chumping/champing/chomping?  LOL. Interesting point however.  That would be gracious of the O's.  Maybe for a prospect?

[wildcard]

On 6/14/2020 at 5:59 AM, Can_of_corn said:

I'm not sold that they would end a relationship with a team just so they can spend money to upgrade another team's facilities.

Nationals Sally League team that is in Hagerstown is on the contraction list.  Frederick draws 4 times as many fans as Hagerstown.  The Learners have money and do spend it to strengthen their team.

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, wildcard said:

Nationals Sally League team is in Hagerstown is on the contraction list.  Frederick draws 4 times as many fans as Hagerstown.  The Learners have money and do spend it to strength their team.

Right, Hagerstown is already on the contraction list.  So if they want to add Frederick they will need to dump a different affiliate.

Do we have evidence of the Learners investing in the infrastructure of their minor league facilities?

[Bill Swaggerty]

50 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Right, Hagerstown is already on the contraction list.  So if they want to add Frederick they will need to dump a different affiliate.

Do we have evidence of the Learners investing in the infrastructure of their minor league facilities?

Do any MLB teams invest (extensively) in the infrastructure of minor league teams? Aside from Spring Training facilities that are used by minor league teams, is that something that is done?