Today's game marks 90 days for Zach Pop with the Marlins

[Philip]

3 hours ago, NelsonCruuuuuz said:

I have zero issues with the Garcia pick, high upside, just didn’t work. Santander did. Ben’s nephew wasn’t on anyone’s radar and heard he was taken as a favor. Not a fan of that decision making. 

During his time in the minors, Garcia was only briefly promoted to AA before being demoted again. The issue with him was control, and he never improved it before being selected. Gambles are based on potential, And that was not a good gamble, Because he had given no indication that he would ever fix his problems. And he didn’t.

[Frobby]

16 minutes ago, Philip said:

During his time in the minors, Garcia was only briefly promoted to AA before being demoted again. The issue with him was control, and he never improved it before being selected. Gambles are based on potential, And that was not a good gamble, Because he had given no indication that he would ever fix his problems. And he didn’t.

As I recall, the bigger issue was that Garcia never showed the velocity that apparently wowed the Orioles during Fall instructs just before they drafted him.   He threw 94-95 during the 2015 season but had been in the upper 90’s in the fall.

[Philip]

20 minutes ago, Frobby said:

As I recall, the bigger issue was that Garcia never showed the velocity that apparently wowed the Orioles during Fall instructs just before they drafted him.   He threw 94-95 during the 2015 season but had been in the upper 90’s in the fall.

As I recall the issue was that he couldn’t throw strikes consistently. He didn’t get promoted a single level during his time in the Boston minors, except very briefly and was almost immediately demoted again. Six years with zero improvement is not a harbinger of success. And regarding throwing hard, we are seeing on a daily basis with Tanner Scott, that throwing hard means nothing if you cannot throw accurately.

Tony was talking about Sceroler’s spin rate as being exceptional, And maybe that’s true, but it wasn’t enough, I don’t know what they were looking for when they drafted Wells, but I am glad they did, maybe it was just that he was 68 and had three pitches.

In the next rule 5, five they will probably focus on quality infielders, And with the Orioles vastly improved analytics, We have a much greater chance of taking a keeper.

Edited June 30, 2021 by Philip

[27outs]

I’ve said this in other forums in April and you can screen cap this one. Mark these words: “Tyler Wells, if healthy, will end up being the ace of this staff.”

 

Admittedly that was before Meansie came out like a Cy Young rocketship, but I’m still gonna stick with the prediction. With a caveat that he could  be the second best. 
 

*prepares for incoming scoffs etc

Edited June 30, 2021 by 27outs

[maybenxtyr]

1 hour ago, 27outs said:

I’ve said this in other forums in April and you can screen cap this one. Mark these words: “Tyler Wells, if healthy, will end up being the ace of this staff.”

 

Admittedly that was before Meansie came out like a Cy Young rocketship, but I’m still gonna stick with the prediction. With a caveat that he could  be the second best. 
 

*prepares for incoming scoffs etc

I hope you are correct. This team needs a lot of help. 

[ArtVanDelay]

3 hours ago, 27outs said:

I’ve said this in other forums in April and you can screen cap this one. Mark these words: “Tyler Wells, if healthy, will end up being the ace of this staff.”

 

Admittedly that was before Meansie came out like a Cy Young rocketship, but I’m still gonna stick with the prediction. With a caveat that he could  be the second best. 
 

*prepares for incoming scoffs etc

Would that be a good thing?

If Tyler Wells is the ace of the staff then Grayson and Hall probably didn’t meet expectations and something happened to Means. Unless Wells really exceeds expectations and becomes our right-handed version of Johan Santana (another Rule V pick). 

[Sports Guy]

47 minutes ago, ArtVanDelay said:

Would that be a good thing?

If Tyler Wells is the ace of the staff then Grayson and Hall probably didn’t meet expectations and something happened to Means. Unless Wells really exceeds expectations and becomes our right-handed version of Johan Santana (another Rule V pick). 

Yea I don’t see any justification to say he is going to better than GRod or Hall and right now, until he shows he can pitch through a lineup multiple times, he is behind Bradish, at least, as well.

[27outs]

29 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Yea I don’t see any justification to say he is going to better than GRod or Hall and right now, until he shows he can pitch through a lineup multiple times, he is behind Bradish, at least, as well.

So guys that haven’t pitched to any lineups in the majors whatsoever, are in your opinion, in FRONT of him because HE hasn’t pitched to enough lineups in the majors for you? Got it.  By the way, Wells had much better numbers in the minors than Bradish. GRod is great. And he very well may be that great in the majors. But there’s a chance he won’t be either. Wells has a career 2.82 ERA, with a 1.06 whip in the minors and a 10.1k/9 with 255 innings. (also better than Hall’s numbers) Not to mention, Tyler Wells has literally gotten better with every level he’s gone up. GRod is your only potentially valid point. And it remains potential. Wells is currently DOING what you’re PROJECTING and yet you have him behind several unproven people LOL. 

Edited June 30, 2021 by 27outs

[27outs]

1 hour ago, ArtVanDelay said:

Would that be a good thing?

If Tyler Wells is the ace of the staff then Grayson and Hall probably didn’t meet expectations and something happened to Means. Unless Wells really exceeds expectations and becomes our right-handed version of Johan Santana (another Rule V pick). 

Now this is a fair assessment. Unlike sportsguy. But my prediction stands. We will see what transpires. But if either of those end up being all people hope for, and Wells is the 4th or 5th stud on the Orioles, then everyone should be blowing Elias 

[ChosenOne21]

Gosh, what ever are we going to do without Pop's 5.46 ERA in 28 low-leverage innings in our pen?

I was higher on Pop than most, and I'm not even upset about this. It seems he isn't as good as we thought he was. There are about a million relievers who can put up mid-5's ERA or better. I'm sure Elias can find some.

[Sports Guy]

2 hours ago, 27outs said:

So guys that haven’t pitched to any lineups in the majors whatsoever, are in your opinion, in FRONT of him because HE hasn’t pitched to enough lineups in the majors for you? Got it.  By the way, Wells had much better numbers in the minors than Bradish. GRod is great. And he very well may be that great in the majors. But there’s a chance he won’t be either. Wells has a career 2.82 ERA, with a 1.06 whip in the minors and a 10.1k/9 with 255 innings. (also better than Hall’s numbers) Not to mention, Tyler Wells has literally gotten better with every level he’s gone up. GRod is your only potentially valid point. And it remains potential. Wells is currently DOING what you’re PROJECTING and yet you have him behind several unproven people LOL. 

Well first of all, you claim you said this in April, so he hadn’t done anything up here yet.

Secondly those MiL numbers were done mostly in the lower minors and he was older than most of his competition. (Not by a lot but still a little older)

Lastly, he is doing it out of the pen.  He isn’t going through lineups multiple times. He hasn’t shown anything that he can do that at this level.  In fact, he really hasn’t shown that he can be starter in the upper levels of the minors either.  He has all of 32 IP in AA.

As for guys who haven’t done it yet…yes, it is a projection…just as you are projecting Wells in a role we don’t know if he can do well in.  
 

You also can’t really comp him to Bradish either because Bradish is showing he can be successful in the upper minors, not to manage he has shown improvement in his stuff since coming here from the Angels.  Sure, he did better than Bradish in A ball.  Ok great but it was in a relatively SSS for both (at the same level).

So yea, I don’t see any evidence that he can be a legit Ml starter, much less a guy who is better than everyone in the organization not named Means.  If he starts this year and is really good, he starts to enter into the conversation but he’s not there yet.

[Frobby]

20 hours ago, ChosenOne21 said:

Gosh, what ever are we going to do without Pop's 5.46 ERA in 28 low-leverage innings in our pen?

I was higher on Pop than most, and I'm not even upset about this. It seems he isn't as good as we thought he was. There are about a million relievers who can put up mid-5's ERA or better. I'm sure Elias can find some.

The question is, what will he be in the longer term?   Remember, this is a guy who only threw 32 innings in AA and then missed almost all of 2019 and 2020.  He wasn’t likely to be instantly successful in the majors.   Let’s see what he is in 2023.    

[ChosenOne21]

2 hours ago, Frobby said:

The question is, what will he be in the longer term?   Remember, this is a guy who only threw 32 innings in AA and then missed almost all of 2019 and 2020.  He wasn’t likely to be instantly successful in the majors.   Let’s see what he is in 2023.    

He could be better than he is this year. I doubt he'll be so much better that it's going to be hard to replace the production

[Frobby]

1 minute ago, ChosenOne21 said:

He could be better than he is this year. I doubt he'll be so much better that it's going to be hard to replace the production

Who knows?   I recall BJ Ryan was very mediocre when he first pitched for us.   He had a 5.91 ERA his first full year here. Pitchers sometimes take a while to click, and like I said, Pop is relatively inexperienced and hadn’t pitched competitively in almost 2 years.   So, we’ll see.    

[jabba72]

On 6/30/2021 at 12:36 PM, Philip said:

As I recall the issue was that he couldn’t throw strikes consistently. He didn’t get promoted a single level during his time in the Boston minors, except very briefly and was almost immediately demoted again. Six years with zero improvement is not a harbinger of success. And regarding throwing hard, we are seeing on a daily basis with Tanner Scott, that throwing hard means nothing if you cannot throw accurately.

Tony was talking about Sceroler’s spin rate as being exceptional, And maybe that’s true, but it wasn’t enough, I don’t know what they were looking for when they drafted Wells, but I am glad they did, maybe it was just that he was 68 and had three pitches.

In the next rule 5, five they will probably focus on quality infielders, And with the Orioles vastly improved analytics, We have a much greater chance of taking a keeper.

Richie Martin says hello.