Will Jacob Nottingham be on our Opening Day roster?

[Sports Guy]

11 minutes ago, Frobby said:

How so?   I don’t think it affects many players at all.  

If they came out with a rule that says drafted college players are FA after their age 28 season, do you think teams would promote players through the minors faster?

[Sports Guy]

6 minutes ago, Pickles said:

You have provided the evidence yourself.

There is no slowrolling of players through the MiLs to game their service time.

It happens in extremely rare and unique circumstances.

He hasn’t provided any evidence for what I’m talking about because there is none.

[Frobby]

3 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

If they came out with a rule that says drafted college players are FA after their age 28 season, do you think teams would promote players through the minors faster?

I think it would affect some players, but not most, or anything close to most.   I think generally, players are promoted to the majors when the team thinks those players are a better option than the players they are replacing, and are ready to handle a major league role.   

[Sports Guy]

1 minute ago, Frobby said:

I think it would affect some players, but not most, or anything close to most.   I think generally, players are promoted to the majors when the team thinks those players are a better option than the players they are replacing, and are ready to handle a major league role.   

It won’t effect most because most don’t get that far to matter.

Im talking about effecting those that actually make the majors.

So, you think teams would just keep guys down and wait for them to turn 24ish (going back to your average age) knowing that they will lose them (or at least could lose them) in just 4 years?

[Pickles]

45 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

He hasn’t provided any evidence for what I’m talking about because there is none.

Can you name the Orioles prospects this has happened to?

AR and Wieters. So one guy a decade.

Most? Lol.

[Sports Guy]

Just now, Pickles said:

Can you name the Orioles prospects this has happened to?

AR and Wieters. So one guy a decade.

Most? Lol.

I think most players drafted out of college, particularly ones that show they can be future MLers, get this treatment.

Luckily in these negotiations, the Orioles aren’t the only team that matters.  There are other teams in mlb that are effected by the CBA.

[Sports Guy]

And btw, I’m just using the college guys as a example.  Rules for Hs and Intl players will alter this as well.

[Pickles]

12 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I think most players drafted out of college, particularly ones that show they can be future MLers, get this treatment.

Luckily in these negotiations, the Orioles aren’t the only team that matters.  There are other teams in mlb that are effected by the CBA.

Then it probably should be pretty easy to give examples.

We are all pretty well-versed in Orioles prospects for the last two decades.

And we have two examples.  Out of hundreds of prospects, dozens of whom went on to have ML careers.

It simply isn't a widespread issue.

[Sports Guy]

5 minutes ago, Pickles said:

Then it probably should be pretty easy to give examples.

We are all pretty well-versed in Orioles prospects for the last two decades.

And we have two examples.  Out of hundreds of prospects, dozens of whom went on to have ML careers.

It simply isn't a widespread issue.

Lol.  Ok.  So you think if they changed the rule to 28, that players would be moved along the minors the same way and teams would wait until 24ish to bring them up to the majors?  Nothing changes?

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Lol.  Ok.  So you think if they changed the rule to 28, that players would be moved along the minors the same way and teams would wait until 24ish to bring them up to the majors?  Nothing changes?

I think it would impact some but not all players. 

Some guys do need more developmental time.

[Sports Guy]

3 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think it would impact some but not all players. 

Some guys do need more developmental time.

Sure..there will be “foot soldiers” who will be developed at the current rate and it’s important for those guys to get to free agency sooner as well because their window of being good is so small. So even if development time stays similar, the end result is still what matters to the players.

The better players will be pushed through faster because teams will want them as long as possible.

[Pickles]

8 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Lol.  Ok.  So you think if they changed the rule to 28, that players would be moved along the minors the same way and teams would wait until 24ish to bring them up to the majors?  Nothing changes?

Of course changing the rules would change behavior.

That isn't proof that there is widespread service time manipulation.

Again, you have no evidence of it.  And all evidence from anecdotal to Frobby's age analysis shows that it isn't widespread.

[Sports Guy]

29 minutes ago, Pickles said:

Of course changing the rules would change behavior.

That isn't proof that there is widespread service time manipulation.

Again, you have no evidence of it.  And all evidence from anecdotal to Frobby's age analysis shows that it isn't widespread.

What proof can you provide?  That player A was left down a year too early?  How are you going to prove that?  You can just say, well I think they need more development time.

The proof will be in the rule change and then see, over the course of time, how it effects how quickly a player is brought up.

By changing the rules, if they do something like an age 28 type thing, players will get brought up faster.

That will tell us that teams don’t need them to be in the minors for as long as they have been.  It will tell us that teams know players can develop at the ML level.  That is when the evidence (in either direction) will be seen.  There is no evidence now.  It’s like trying to prove a rumor.  

You said it yourself..behavior will change.  Of course it will and that’s why the players will want it.

But this is all part of the bigger issue of suppressing players time.  Leaving them in the minors too long and waiting a year or even 2 too long to push them through the system is a way of manipulating their service time and it pushes them that much further away from free agency..which is the actual issue.

 

[RZNJ]

6 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

What proof can you provide?  That player A was left down a year too early?  How are you going to prove that?  You can just say, well I think they need more development time.

The proof will be in the rule change and then see, over the course of time, how it effects how quickly a player is brought up.

By changing the rules, if they do something like an age 28 type thing, players will get brought up faster.

That will tell us that teams don’t need them to be in the minors for as long as they have been.  It will tell us that teams know players can develop at the ML level.  That is when the evidence (in either direction) will be seen.  There is no evidence now.  It’s like trying to prove a rumor.  
 

But this is all part of the bigger issue of suppressing players time.  Leaving them in the minors too long and waiting a year or even 2 too long to push them through the system is a way of manipulating their service time and it pushes them that much further away from free agency..which is the actual issue.

 

You think teams are slow playing players in the minors to stall their debut in the majors up to 2 years?    

[Sports Guy]

3 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

You think teams are slow playing players in the minors to stall their debut in the majors up to 2 years?    

Maybe not 2 years.  I think that’s more of an extreme example in that you get guys that need no to very little MiL team at all.

I think Adley could have been brought up immediately and been fine.  But that’s an extreme case, I admit.

But I do think if you see this rule change that you will see more of this.